Jun 28, 2022 BCC Workshop

[CALL TO ORDER]

[00:00:07]

>> OKAY. LET'S GET OUR SEATS.

WE'LL CALL THE WORKSHOP TO ORDER.

THIS IS THE JUNE 28TH WORKSHOP AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MAINLY BUILDING CODES AND ALL THOSE SORTS OF THINGS.

[PUBLIC COMMENTS]

WE'LL GO STRAIGHT TO PUBLIC COMMENT.

FIRST ONE I'VE GOT IS JESSICA? I CAN'T TELL WHAT THIS SAYS.

FIELDS? IT LOOKS LIKE SOMETHING DIFFERENT ON HERE. I'M SURE IT'S ME.

>> GOOD MORNING. I DIDN'T KNOW I WAS GOING TO BE UP FIRST. SO I SPOKE WITH YA'LL AT THE LAST MEETING ABOUT THE PUD ZONE AND HOW IT'S AFFECTING OUR FAMILY. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND HEARING OUR CONCERNS. TO SUMMARIZE WHAT I SAID LAST TIME OUR FAMILY IS IN AN UNBELIEVABLE SITUATION.

WE NEED TO MOVE AND SOON. WITH THE CURRENT HOUSING MARKET FINDING AFFORDABLE HOUSING HAS PROVEN QUITE DIFFICULT.

UNLESS YOU CAN AFFORD OVER $350 YOU CAN'T FIND A DECENT HOUSE AND THERE'S LITTLE OPTIONS AVAILABLE TO THE AVERAGE FAMILY.

WE THOUGHT WE WOULD PURCHASE A PROPERTY WITH HOPES TO HAVE A MANUFACTURES HOME ON THE LAND. WE HAVE A LARGE FAMILY WITH 11 CHILDREN SO SQUARE FEET IS IMPORTANT TO US.

WE WOULD ENJOY TO HAVE THE LAND FOR THE KIDS TO CREATE CHILDHOOD MEMORIES. UNFORTUNATELY IT'S IN THE PUD ZONE AND IS HINDERING US FROM PUTTING A NEWMAN FACT TO OURED HOME ON OUR LAND. NOW THIS SEEMS IMPOSSIBLE.

WE'RE PRAYERFUL WE CAN ACHIEVE THE DREAM OF RAISING OUR FAMILY ON THIS LAND. I'M HERE TO ASK YOU HOW THIS ZONING IS AFFECTING RESIDENTS TO GET AN AFFORDABLE HOME IN THIS CRAZY HOUSE CRISIS WE'RE ALL SEEING.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU.

PATRICK LEE? >> GOOD MORNING.

I'M PATRICK HE AND I LIVE ON FLEMMING ISLAND AND HAVE FOR 34 YEARS. GREAT WORKSHOP.

THANK YOU SO MUCH. STICK WITH ME IN MY METAPHOR AS I START THIS. I WAS AN AIRLINE PILOT AND FOR 20 YEARS I FLEW OUT OF MICHIGAN. MOST TRIPS WERE MUNDANE AND EASY BUT IN THE WINTERTIME IN DETROIT, IT WAS A WHOLE DIFFERENT WORLD. I'D BE TASKED TO FLY A LOT OF PEOPLE AND THEIR EQUIPMENT INTO A LITTLE AIRPORT WITH A BLIZZARD AND TOWERS CLOSED AND THE LAST BRAKING ACTION WAS 45 MINUTES AGO BY A TRUCK AND I WOULD SAY, MAN I HOPE THIS AIRPLANE STOPS.

THE METAPHOR IS WE HAVE A BLIZZARD IN CLAY COUNTY CALLED THE BY PASS AND IT HAS CHANGED OUR COUNTY AS YOU GUYS ALL KNOW.

IT HAS INVITED EVERY DEVELOPER IN THE SOUTHEAST TO COME DOWN AND BE PART OF THE GROWTH OF OUR COUNTRY.

EXCUSE ME. WE ARE RELYING ON YOU TO CONTROL THIS GROWTH. THE GROWTH HAS TO BE MANAGED AND FOCUSED AND IT HAS TO NOT BE AT THE WHIM OF EVERY DEVELOPER THAT COMES DOWN AND TRIES TO INFLUENCE YOU ON YOUR DECISIONS ON HOW OUR COUNTY GROWS. WE NOTICE THAT AIRPORTS ARE ON THE AGENDA TODAY AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE, BUT WE WANT TO JUST ENCOURAGE YOU TO REALIZE THAT NO MORE ON TUESDAYS, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE SO EASY GIVING AWAY PETS. YOU ARE GOING TO BE TASKED WITH CONTROLLING THE GROWTH IN OUR COUNTRY AND MAKING SURE IT'S MANAGED, MAKING SURE COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE BEEN HERE FOR GENERATIONS ARE NOT ADVERSELY AFFECTED BY OUR PROGRESS AND WE LOVE THE PROGRESS, BUT WE'RE RLYING ON THE FIVE OF YOU TO BE THE BACKSTOP FOR THE GROWTH IN OUR COUNTY AND MAKE SURE IT'S DONE CORRECTLY AND WE'RE WILLING TO HELP IN ANYWAY WE CAN.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

THAT'S PART OF WHAT THIS WORKSHOP IS ABOUT.

WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHICH LEVER DOES WHAT UP HERE, BUT IT

[00:05:05]

ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? S

SIR? >> I'M A CLAY COUNTY RESIDENT AND I'M JOHN BENTON. CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW? I'M A CLAY COUNTY RESIDENT AND I GREW UP HERE.

LOOKING AT THE GROWTH THAT'S HAPPENING IN THE LAKE PUD AREA, I DON'T SEE INFRASTRUCTURE COMING IN TO SUPPORT THE AMOUNT OF HOMES BEING BUILT OUT THERE. YOU'VE GOT TWO GAS STATIONS OFF OF HENLEY ROAD AND 3,000 HOMES BEING BUILT RIGHT NOW THAT WILL BRING IN ABOUT 15,000 PEOPLE. WHERE IS THE INFRASTRUCTURE TO HELP SUPPORT AND IS RIDGE ROAD AND SOME OF THE OTHERS IN THIS AREA. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? OKAY. WE'LL CLOSE PUBLIC HEARING AND

[1.  Comprehensive Update of Articles III and VII of the Land Development Code (presented by WGI as the consultants)]

>> SO I'LL INTRODUCE THEM SO WE HAVE WGI HERE AND THEY'RE OUR CONSULTANTS THAT WE HAVE HIRED TO TAKE THE TWO BIGGEST CHAPTERS OR TWO MOST CUMBERSOME CHAPTERS OF OUR 13 CHAPTER LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. THEY WILL BE WORKING AND HAVE WORKED MOSTLY ON ARTICLE THREE AND 7.

ARTICLE 7 TO COME TO YOU GUYS FIRST WE HAVE BYE WEEKLY MEETING WITH THEM. I THINK IT'S BY WEEKLY SO THEY'VE BEEN WORKING FOR US FOR A LITTLE WHILE AND ARE ALREADY DOING SOME EXCITING STUFF. WE'RE EXCITED TO HAVE THEM TODAY AND ON BOARD. WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD TO HAVING OUR CODE CLEANED UP. I THINK EVERY SINCE I GOT HERE THAT'S BEEN A GOAL TO GET THAT THING CLEANED UP.

WHEN YOU HAVE YOUR PLANNING AND ZONING ARTICLE THREE THAT'S LIKE 547 PAGES WE HAVE A PROBLEM. THEY'LL BE HELPING US WITH THAT SO THIS IS COURTNEY POWELL AND SHE'LL INTRODUCE HER TEAM TO KICK THIS OFF THIS MORNING. ANGLE ANGELA.

>> I'M ANGELA WITH WGI AND WE'RE EXCITED TO KICK-OFF THIS LAND DEVELOPMENT REVISION CODE PROCESS WITH YOU GUYS.

WE HAVE A GREAT TEAM OF PLANNERS HERE.

COURTNEY POWELL IS YOUR PROJECT MANAGER.

ERICA IS ONE OF OUR PLANNERS, BUT CLAY COUNTY LIAISON ERIC LANDING IS HERE WITH US, AS WELL.

WGI, WE'RE USERS OF YOUR CODE THROUGH OUR MANY TASK QUARTERS UNDER OUR CONTRACT, AS WELL AS THROUGH THE BONDED TRANSPORTATION PROGRAM. THE PURPOSE WE'RE HERE TODAY, WE'RE HERE TO UPDATE THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THIS PROCESS IS BEING JOINTLY LED BY WGI AND STAFF.

ONE OF THE MAIN GOALS IS TO ENSURE THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE IS COMPLIANT AND CONSISTENT WITH YOUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

WE'LL LOOK AT REORGANIZING THE LAYOUT OF THE ARTICLES AND INCREASE THE USER-FRIENDLYNESS AND ADD MORE TABLES AND TO MAKE IT MORE USER-FRIENDLY. WE'LL MAKE SURE THAT THE CODE REMAINS ADA COMPLIANT IN ALL FORMATS TO YOU AND WE'RE LOOKING FOR THE FIELD IN THE LAKE AND TRYING TO CONSOLIDATE MASTER PLANS INTO THE STANDARD CODE LANGUAGE, AS WELL.

NEXT SLIDE? WGI'S SCOPE.

WE'RE PRIMARILY LOOKING AT ARTICLE THREE YOUR ZONING CODE AND ARTICLE 7, THE SIGN CODE. WE'RE HOLISTICALLY LOOKING AT THE OTHER ARTICLES TO MAKE SURE THEIR CONSISTENT WITH STAFF AND VICE VERSA. THERE WILL BE MINOR UPDATES TO ARTICLE ONE WHICH IS THE DEFINITION EXCEPTION TO BE CONSISTENT WITH ANYTHING IN ARTICLES THREE AND SEVEN AND OUR FINAL DELIVER REASONABLE WILL BE A WORD DOCUMENT, AS WELL AS PDF ON YOUR WEBSITE AND THOSE WILL BE AGAIN, ADA COMPLIANT.

NEXT SLIDE. A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE TWO

[00:10:03]

WE'RE LOOKING AT PERMITS SPECIFIC USES TO THOSE DISTRICTS. THIS IS WHERE WE'LL GO TO FIND SETBACKS AND DIMENSIONAL AREAS AND THE BRAND NEW LAKE AND FIELD. ARTICLE 7 IS SIGNAGE CODE GOVERNING ALL SIGNS RESIDENTIAL AND NON-RESIDENTIAL.

IT DOES NOT GOVERN CONTENT, BUT PRIMARILY FORM AND FUNCTION.

IT'S WHERE WE'LL GO FOR DIMENSIONAL STANDARDS AND NUMBER OF SIGNS AND THE SIZE OF THOSE AND WHAT'S PERMITTED IN DIFFERENT ZONING DISTRICTS. YOU AS THE BCC ULTIMATELY WE'LL COME BEFORE YOU IN HOPES TO ADOPT THESE CHANGES, BUT WE'RE LOOKING FOR YOUR LEADERSHIP AND GUIDANCE AND VISION, AS WELL AS TO BE CHAMPIONS THROUGH OUR COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.

WE'LL BE BACK TO LOOK AT DRAFTS, BUT THE FINAL WILL BE TO GO TO PLANNING COMMISSION FOR RECOMMENDATION AND WE'LL COME BACK AT THE END TO PROCESS. WITH THAT I'LL LET COURTNEY

SPEAK. >> THANK YOU FOR HAVING US THIS MORNING. AS ANGELA SAID WE'RE EMBARK ON A BIG PUBLIC PROCESS FOR THIS CODE REWRITE OF ARTICLE THREE AND SEVEN. THIS IS KIND OF OUR GENERAL ROAD MAP OF WHERE WE'RE STARTING AND GOING SO WE HAVE BEEN DOING A LOT OF REVIEW AND ANALYSIS OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND OTHER PERTINENT DOCUMENTS AND WE'RE HERE AT THE COMMISSIONER KICK-OFF AND LATER WE'LL HAVE A STAKEHOLDER MEETING TO LAUNCH THE PROJECT. WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE TIME LINE YOU SEE ANY ORANGE, THAT'S EVERYTHING DEFINED FOR ARTICLE 7, THE SIGN CODE, WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THAT ALREADY AND THE INTENT IS TO CONSOLIDATE AND MAKING SURE IT'S COMPLIANT WITH NOT REGULATING CONTENT SO WE'LL START TO WORK ON DRAFTS AND WE'LL SEND IT TO STAFF FOR REVIEW TO PASS ON FOR YOUR INPUT AS WE MOVE THROUGH THIS PROCESS. WE ENVISION AS OF TODAY THERE WOULD BE PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT WITH LARGE GROUPS AND INDIVIDUAL CONVERSATIONS AND SEEING HOW THE PROCESS GOES SO WE'RE TARGETING AN OPEN HOUSE AT THE END OF SUPPER AND WE FEEL THAT'S A GOOD TIME TO KICK-OFF ARTICLE THREE AND THEN WE'LL CONTINUE THROUGHOUT THE YEAR WITH MORE STAKEHOLDER MEETINGS AND OTHER BBC UPDATE AND PUBLIC OPEN HOUSE AND BOTH WILL BE WORKSHOP STYLE.

WE WOULD HAVE POSTER BOARDS TO LOOK AT WHAT'S IN THE CODE, OUR RECOMMENDATIONS AND WHAT WE'RE HEARING FROM THE COMMUNITY.

THEN AT THE START OF THE YEAR, WE'LL HAVE ANOTHER PUBLIC MEETING AND A STAKEHOLDER MEETING AND WE HOPE TO HAVE A GOOD DRAFT OF ARTICLE THREE TO SHARE FOR THE PUBLIC AND WE HAVE A PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD BEFORE IT COMES INTO THE APPROVAL PROCESS FOR FEEDBACK. WE'RE LOOKING TO WRAP UP THE PROJECT BY JULY OF 2023. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE SO WHERE WE STAND TODAY AS I MENTIONED WE'VE BEEN DOING A LOT OF ANALYSIS ON THE EXISTING COUNTY CODE DOCUMENTS.

THE BRANDON FIELD AS WE HAVE HEARD THERE'S A LOT OF REGULATIONS IN THERE THAT WOULD HIKE TO BE INCORPORATED INTO THE STANDARD CODE. WE'VE BEEN DOING THE ARTICLE 7 SIGN REGULATIONS ANALYSIS AND CONSOLATION FOR THAT.

WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON TEMPLATES THAT ARE EASY FOR ALL USERS TO UNDERSTAND AND WE WILL BE SUBMITTING THOSE TO STAFF FOR INPUT, AS WELL AS YOUR TO PASS ALONG.

STAY TUNED FOR THOSE DRAFTS COMING SOON.

[00:15:02]

WHERE WE ARE GOING IN THE SHORT-TERM IS THE DRAFT OF ARTICLE 7 TO SUBMIT FOR STAFF AND WE'D LIKE TO RECEIVE ALL INPUT ON THAT BEFORE WE GET GOING ON ARTICLE 3 AND THEN WE ARE LOOKING TO HAVE A FORMAL DRAFT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION FOR THE OCTOBER 4TH MEETING TO GET THAT COMPLETED AGAIN BEFORE LAUNCHING ARTICLE 3 WHICH IS WHERE THE HEAVY LIFTING WILL

OCCUR. >> MIDTERM ONCE WE FINISH ARTICLE 7 WE'LL DIVE INTO ARTICLE 3 WHERE THE PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT WILL KICK-OFF OFFICIALLY AND WE'LL HAVE A LOT OF INPUT AND FEEDBACK. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE? LONG-TERM, WE'LL HAVE COMPLETE DRAFT OF ARTICLE 3 THE BIG HEAVY LIFT OF 500 AND SOMETHING PAGES AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN MAKE IT MORA D.A. ACCESSIBILITY AND GEARED TOWARDS MANAGING YOUR GROWTH IN THE COMMUNITY. AS PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED WE'LL HAVE OUR FIRST STAKEHOLDER MEETING FOLLOWING THIS MEETING AT 1:00 P.M. IN THIS BUILDING. WE'RE HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. THANK YOU.

>> MAYBE I MISSED IT, BUT I DID NOT SEE ANY LOOK AT FLORIDA STATUTE? I DIDN'T SEE ANY LOOK AT MUNICIPAL IMPACT, AS WELL. WHO'S LOOKING UP AND DOWN THE

REGULATORY REQUIREMENT? >> WE DO LOOK THE GAMUT.

WE HAVE ANOTHER PERSON ON OUR TEAM THAT'S VERY WELL-VERSED FLORIDA STATUTES AND REGULATIONS.

SHE WAS UNFORTUNATELY NOT ABLE TO BE HERE BUT WE DO LOOK AT THE RANGE AND HOW IT CONNECTS BECAUSE THAT HAS A LOT OF IMPACT ON WHAT YOU CAN DO AT THE COUNTY LEVEL.

>> SO THAT'S ALL PART OF THIS STUDY?

>> YES. >> THANK YOU.

ANYBODY ELSE? COMMISSIONER CELLA?

ANYTHING TO ADD? >> JUST A COMMENT.

IF YOU DRIVE DOWN THE BOULEVARD IT LOOKS LIKE A CIRCUS WITH ALL THE SIGNS. I THINK THIS IS A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO CLEAN THAT UP. I'M NOT TRYING TO PUT ANYBODY OUT OF BUSINESS, BUT WE CAN MAKE IT LOOK A LITTLE BETTER.

>> THANK YOU. >> ALRIGHT.

WELL THANK YOU. >> I WOULD JUST ADD ONE COMMENT AS WE'RE GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS WE HAVE AN E-MAIL AT LDC CHANGES AT CLAY COUNTY GO VDOT COM.

SO FOLKS LISTENING THEY HAVE SOMETHING THEY WANT TO SEND OUR WAY WE HAVE THAT SPECIFIC E-MAIL FOR THAT AS WE GO FORWARD THROUGH THE PROCESS. LDCC LDCCHANGES@CLAYCOUNTY.COM

[2.  Manufactured Housing vs Modular Housing]

. >> I'LL CALL ON MIKE AND STEVE FOR MANUFACTURED HOUSING AND MODULAR HOUSING AND I'LL GET OUT

OF THE WAY FOR A FEW MINUTES. >> GOOD MORNING, COMMISSIONERS.

AS WE GO INTO THIS DISCUSSION, MY PART OF THIS IS TO PROVIDE SOME DEFINITION, SO THE WORDS KIND OF MEAN THINGS.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MANUFACTURED HOUSING AND MODULAR HOUSING IS THE WAY, THE STANDARDS OF HOW THEY ARE CONSTRUCTED. THEY'RE BOTH BUILT IN A FACTORY ENVIRONMENT. THE MANUFACTURING HOUSING POPULARLY IS REFERRED TO AS A MOBILE HOME IS HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLE HOOD STANDARDS.

IT'S BUILT ACCORDING TO THE FLORIDA BUILDING CODE.

THEY LOOK THE SAME GOING DOWN THE HIGHWAY, BUT THEY ARE TREATED DIFFERENTLY BY LAW. THE MODULAR HOUSING IS TREATED LIKE IF YOU MOVE A RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE, IT IS A SINGLE FAMILY HOME WHEN SET UP ON THE LOT AND IT'S TREATED AS SUCH AND THE MANUFACTURED MOBILE HOME IS REFERRED TO AS THAT FOR IT'S ENTIRE LIFE-SPAN. ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE

DIFFERENCES? >> MODULAR HOUSING IS BUILT TO

FLORIDA BUILDING CODE STANDARDS? >> WHAT'S A WASA HOME? WHAT IS THAT? THEY BUILD THEM IN A FACTORY IN

[00:20:04]

PIECES ASSEMBLE THEM ON A SLAB? >> THOSE ARE TYPICALLY BUILT AS A MODULAR HOUSING BUILD, AS WELL.

WELL, THAT WOULD BE, IT'S KIND OF A PANEL TYPE BUILDING SO IT WOULD BE MORE CONSIDERED SITE BUILT.

IT'S STILL TREATED THE SAME AS A SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING BUT IT'S A SITE BUILT HOME THAT CAME OUT IN PANELS AS A POSED TO A MODULAR HOUSING THAT'S BUILD IN THE FACTORY SETTING.

>> WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MODULAR HOUSING.

STILL HUNG UP HERE. I UNDERSTAND MOBILE HOME HAS A TONGUE AND WHEELS SOME PLACE. A MODULAR HOME DOES NOT HAVE

WHEELS OR A TONGUE? >> IT DOES WHEN IT'S DELIVERED

TO THE SITE IT DOES. >> THEN THEY REMOVE THE FRAME?

>> THE FRAME IS STILL THERE. GOING DOWN THE HIGHWAY IT'S HARD TO TELL THE DIFFERENCE. EVEN THE MANUFACTURER OF THE MOBILE HOME HAS TO HAVE THE TONGUE AND AXELS REMOVED WHEN IT SITS ON THE PROPERTY. SO MANY TIMES THEY ARE SET UP THE SAME, LOOK ALMOST EXACTLY THE SAME WHEN THEY GO IN, BUT IN THE FACTORY SETTING THEY ARE CONSTRUCTED ACCORDING TO

DIFFERENT STANDARDS. >> WHAT WOULD SOME OF THOSE STANDARDS BE? ARE THEY BETTER HURRICANE PROOF?

>> DIFFERENT SIZES AND SPACING. THE FIT AND FINISH IS A DIFFERENT THING WHEN YOU WALK IN THE BUILDING YOU CAN TELL THE DIFFERENCE THAT WAY. SOME OF THE TIE DOWNS, WELL THEY HAVE THE SAME WIND ZONE AND THAT SORT OF THING.

THERE'S DIFFERENT FEATURES IN THE MODULAR HOUSING THAT ARE NOT IN THE MANUFACTURED HOUSING AND IT'S THOSE KINDS OF DIFFERENCES.

IT'S THE STUFF THAT'S BEHIND THE DRY WALL.

>> OKAY. WHAT IS A PRE-FAB METAL BUILDING

CONSIDERED? >> A PRE-FAB METAL BUILDING.

I MEAN, THOSE DON'T QUALIFY AS THIS BECAUSE THAT'S NOT A DWELLING. THESE ARE SPECIFICALLY DWELLING UNITS. THAT'S KIND OF THE DIFFERENCE WITH THAT. THE MANUFACTURED METAL BUILDINGS

ARE NOT DESIGNED AS A RESIDENTS. >> YET.

>> THAT AS POPULAR DISCUSSION THAT WE'RE HAVING.

I DON'T KNOW IF HDTV HAS A BARN SHOW OUT NOW AND WE'RE GETTING A BUNCH OF THAT AND IT'S A CHALLENGE FOR US TO GET THOSE

THROUGH THE PERMITTING PROCESS. >> I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE BREAK POINTS. FROM A SAFETY POINT OF VIEW AND THE FLORIDA BUILDING CODE THEY'RE ALL THE SAME AMOUNT OF STRENGTH WHEN A HURRICANE COMES, IS THAT CORRECT?

>> YES, SIR. THERE ARE WIND STANDARDS THEY

HAVE TO MEET FOR THE COUNTY. >> IF YOU BELIEVE THE ENGINEERS,

THEY ARE, RIGHT? >> YES, SIR.

>> SOMETHING THAT SPEAKS TO ME IS YOU TOLD ME WHEN WE MET THAT THESE COST MORE THAN AM MOBILE HOME, BUT THE PAY ENDS UP BEING

LESS. >> THERE'S ALL SORTS OF FINANCIAL CONSIDERATIONS WITH THAT.

THE HOMEOWNERS INSURANCE IS TREATED DIFFERENTLY.

THE APPRECIATION OF THE BUILDINGS DIFFERENT.

YOUR MORTGAGE RATES ARE DIFFERENT.

>> BUT IT'S ALL BETTER FROM EVERYTHING I HAVE HEARD.

>> YES, MA'AM. >> I MEAN INSURANCE, THEY ALL KNOW SOMETHING SO EVIDENTLY THEY'RE TREATING IT AS SUCH SO THAT TELLS ME A LOT WITHOUT KNOWING MUCH ABOUT IT THAT IF INSURANCE AND MORTGAGE RATES, EVERYTHING IS BETTER SO YOU PAY 50,000 MORE, BUT YOUR MONTHLY PAYMENT WILL BE ABOUT THE SAME

AND APPRECIATION IS BETTER. >> AGAIN THE LONG-TERM

RAMIFICATION ARE ->> THAT PRETTY MUCH TELLS ME THE STORY.

>> LONG-TERM RAMIFICATIONS ARE WHAT?

>> PREFERABLE FOR A MODULAR HOUSING.

>> THAN FROM THE STRAIGHT MOBILE HOME.

>> WE SHOULD BE CAREFUL. WE HAVE A LOT OF RESIDENTS THAT LIVE SAFELY IN MANUFACTURED HOUSING AND I DON'T WANT ANYONE

[00:25:01]

>> YEAH. AGAI

AGAIN. >> IF THERE'S A FINANCIAL DIFFERENCE BUT IF IT IS A CHOICE THAT THEY MAKE, IN MY OPINION WE DON'T NEED TO CHANGE OUR LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE OR ZONING CODES TO NOT ALLOW FOR THE TYPE OF DWELLING THAT A LOT OF OUR RESIDENTS CHOOSE TO LIVE IN AND CAN AFFORD TO LIVE IN.

>> THAT'S THE PRECURSOR, BUT THIS DISCUSSION IS THAT WE'RE LOOKING TO LOOSEN SOME OF THAT UP SO AS THAT DISCUSSION GOES FORWARD THAT'S WHY THE DEFINITIONS WERE IMPORTANT SO WE KNOW THE DIFFERENCE OF WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

>> COMMISSIONER RENNIGER? >> MANUFACTURED HOUSING ARE

BUILT TO WHAT STANDARD? >> HUD.

>> NOT THE FLORIDA MOTOR VEHICLE STANDARD?

>> RIGHT. H

HUD. >> AM I TO INFER THAT FLORIDA BUILDING CODE DOES NOT MEET HUD STANDARDS.

THEY HAVE TWO DIFFERENT STANDARDS.

>> THEY ARE JUST DIFFERENT. >> DID WE BEAT THIS ONE TO

DEATH? >> JUST TRYING TO FIND THE DIFFERENCE. DIFFERENCE IS FINE.

BETTER IS WHERE I WAS LIKE, I'M ALL FOR MOBILE HOMES.

>> THE KEY IS THAT WE'RE NOT TRYING TO MAKE A DETERMINATION OF WHICH ONE IS BETTER THAN ANOTHER, I THINK WE'RE LOOKING FOR WAYS IN WHICH WE CAN OPEN UP THE FIELD, IF YOU WILL FOR THE RESIDENTS AND CONSUMERS TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO PUT ONE OR THE OTHER, BOTH ARE ADEQUATE WHICH THEY ARE UNDER STANDARDS AND IN THE SAME PLACE AND HOW IS THAT ACCOMPLISHED, RIGHT SO WE CAN FIGURE OUT WHETHER IT'S MRS. FIELDS OR SOMEONE ELSE TO PUT THIS HERE AND RIGHT NOW WE'RE TELLING THEM CHOICE B HAS TO GO THERE EVEN THOUGH, BOTH ARE EQUALLY MEETING STANDARDS, BUT DIFFERENT STANDARDS. OUR CODE DOESN'T CALL FOR MEETING THOSE NEEDS IN TERMS OF HAVING MANUFACTURED HOUSING OR

MODULAR HOUSING. >> LET ME JUST TERM SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING IS NOT TO BE CONSTRUEED TO INCLUDE MOBILE HOME, WHICH INCLUDES THE MANUFACTURED HOUSING.

APPARENTLY, THERE ARE ONLY THREE DISTRICT WHERE'S THESE ARE ALLOWED. AG ZONING DISTRICT.

AG RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICT AND THEN OF COURSE THE RESIDENTIAL MOBILE HOME PARK. BOTH THE MASTER PLAN AREAS ARE PROHIBITED AND MANUFACTURE/MOBILE AND ALL THE OTHER RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS.

AS COMMISSIONER CELLA INDICATED, AND STAFF IS LOOKING AT TRYING TO EXPAND WHERE MANUFACTURED HOUSING MAY BE ALLOWED IN ADDITION AND WE'VE HAD THIS ISSUE COME UP WITH BOTH OF TWO DIFFERENT DISTRICTS RECENTLY. I WILL JUST BE UP FRONT.

LAKE ASBURY IS A LITTLE HARDER TO KNOW HOW TO APPROACH AND WE'RE WORKING ON IT. WITH THE BRANNEN FIELD I BELIEVE MAYBE THERE'S AN EASIER FIX AND I'LL THROW THIS OUGHT TO SEE IF IT MIGHT BE A DIRECTION THAT THE BOARD WANTS STAFF TO GO TOWARDS.

IN THE RURAL SUBURBS CATEGORY OF BRANNEN FIELD, THAT'S OUR LOWEST DENSITY THERE SO THE LOTS ARE BIGGER.

THEY ARE A MINIMUM LOT SIZE OF FOUR ACRES.

THAT AREA HAS A LOT OF EXISTING MOBILE HOMES, MANUFACTURED HOUSING IN THERE BEFORE BRANNEN FIELD CAME TO BE AND THEY'VE CONTINUED TO BE THERE. WE THINK THAT A PLACE, A DISTRICT IN THE BRANNEN FIELD THAT MAY BE WORTHWHILE EXPLORING

[00:30:02]

WE THINK IT MIGHT BE BEST TO STILL PROHIBIT THEM IN PLATTED SUBDIVISIONS WITHIN THE RURAL SUBURBS BECAUSE TODAY MOST OF THOSE ARE BUILT OUT WITH SITE BUILT SINGLE FAMILY STRUCTURES.

IF THEY ARE 90% BUILT OUT AND THERE'S TWO OR THREE LOTS, I WOULD ANTICIPATE THE PHONE WOULD BE JUST RINGING CONSTANTLY IF A MANUFACTURED HOME CAME INTO THOSE SUBDIVISIONS.

AT THIS POINT STAFF WOULD LIKE DIRECTION ON BEING ABLE TO ALLOW MANUFACTURED HOUSING IN THE BRANNEN FIELD RURAL SUBFIELD AREAS ONLY AND STILL PROHIBIT THEM IN EXISTING PLATTED SUBDIVISIONS AND THEN WE'RE STILL LOOKING AT THE LAKE AND WE'LL COME BACK IN THE FUTURE WITH AN OPTION FOR THAT.

IT IS A LITTLE MORE PROBLEMATIC THAN THE BRANNEN FIELD WOULD LIKE TO GO. WE'D LIKE INPUT FROM THE BOARD IF THAT'S AN ACCEPTABLE APPROACH OR IF THERE'S CONCERNS OR IDEAS

YOU MIGHT HAVE. >> I VOICED THIS BEFORE.

I'D RATHER SEE APARTMENTS GO UP IN THE AIR AS A SOLUTION TO THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING THAN TO CREATE BIG TRACTS OF MOBILE HOMES AGAIN. THAT'S WHERE I'M COMING IN ON THIS, AND IF THERE IS MOBILE HOMES ON THE PROPERTIES NOW AND THEIR GRANDFATHERED IN I WOULD NOT BE OPPOSED TO TAKE A LOOK AT A FEW OF THOSE PLACES, BUT GENERALLY LIKE IN RIDGEWOOD THERE'S DEVELOPERS BUYING THOSE TO PUT IN STICK BUILD HOUSES AND THAT'S KIND OF THE TREND RIGHT NOW.

I DON'T THINK I WOULD SUPPORT PUTTING ANIMO BILE HOME IN AN OPEN LOT. THAT'S A REAL NO, NO.

I UNDERSTAND WE HAVE AN ISSUE WITH AFFORDABLE HOUSING, BUT THERE'S OTHER WAYS. PEOPLE HAVE TO HAVE AN AFFORDABLE PLACE TO LIVE, BUT MY SOLUTION WOULD BE A LITTLE BETTER UPSCALE THAN PUTTING IN A LOT OF MOBILE HOMES.

IT TAKES UP LOT OF LAND AND THEN WE CREATE A DENSITY AREA IN ONE AREA RATHER THAN HAVING LOTS AND LOTS OF THESE ALL OVER THE PLACE. COMMISSIONER CELLA?

>> WE'D CHECK ON WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE IN TERMS OF WHERE IS THE ROYAL SUBURB IN TERMS OF THE ZONING MAPS IN TERMS OF BEING AS COMMISSIONER BOLLA INDICATED, HOW WIDESPREAD THAT WOULD BE.

I'M NOT AS ADVERSEED TO HAVING PEOPLE OWN THEIR OWN PROPERTIES.

THAT'S PART OF WHAT MAKES A COMMUNITY IF YOU CAN ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO EARN THEIR OWN LAND IN THIS CASE A MODULAR HOUSING OR MANUFACTURED HOUSING WHATEVER THEY CHOOSE.

THE KEY IS TO GIVE MORE HOUSING. YOU CAN CERTAINLY GET YOURSELF A HOME OWNER SO THIS IS ESSENTIAL TO A COMMUNITY, AS WELL.

SO I'M NNOT AGAINST THEM BUT THY HAVE TO BE IN THE RIGHT AREA.

>> OR CONDOS. >> THAT WOULD BE A KQUITY BUILDR FOR PEOPLE. I'D LIKE TO SEE HOW MANY RURAL

SUBURBS WE HAVE. >> IF THIS IS THE DIRECTION THE BOARD DESIRES TO GO THAT WOULD BE PART OF WHEN WE COME BACK WITH THE STAFF REPORT AND THE APPROVAL WE'LL HAVE THAT

INFORMATION. >> IN TERMS OF LIKE THE LAKE, DO

[00:35:03]

WE HAVE A LOT OF RURAL SUBURB? >> NO IT IS A DIFFERENT CATEGORY AND THAT'S WHY. IT'S MORE WIDESPREAD SO STAFF WANTS A CLOSER LOOK AT THAT SO WE'LL BRING SOMETHING BACK TO

YOU ON THAT. >> YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHY THERE WAS AN OPT IN AND OPT OUT IN THE MASTER PLAN.

>> WHEN LAKE ASBURY AS MY UNDERSTANDING, THERE WAS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR LANDOWNERS AT THAT TIME TO OPT OUT OF THE NOT THE PLAN, BUT OUT OF THE REGULATIONS IF THAT MAKES SENSE SO YOU'LL SEE AT THE LAKE WHERE YOU'LL HAVE SOME STRAIGHT ZONING DISTRICTS. THERE'S AR STRAIGHT ZONING DISTRICTS SO THAT MAKES IT MORE COMPLICATED BECAUSE YOU'LL HAVE FIVE 5R PARCELS SURROUNDED BY THE LAKE RURAL COMMUNITY AND SO THAT'S WHY IT'S A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED AND TAKES MORE TIME TO LOOK AT HOW THAT IMPACTS NEIGHBORS AND ADJACENT EXISTING DEVEL DEVELOPMENT.

>> I WOULD SUPPORT MOVING FORWARD WITH STAFF AND EVEN IF YOU WANT TO LOOK AT IT ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS.

IF FOR INSTANCE IN THIS SITUATION IF SHE WANTED TO BRING THAT TO STAFF AND STAFF FOR REVIEW I THINK THAT WOULD BE MAYBE A SOLUTION TO THE COMMISSIONER'S CONCERNS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT EACH INDIVIDUAL PROPERTY OR FOR NOT REALLY SPOT ZONING, BUT MORE OF WHERE WE GO TO ALLOW IT SURROUNDED BY MANUFACTURED HOMES I GLEE IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE ON ANY VACANT LOT THAT HAPPENED HAVE EITHER RURAL SUBURBS AND WE HAVE THAT WITH AG AND AG RESIDENTIAL SO I WOULD EVEN BE OPEN TO THAT, I JUST THINK IT'S DIFFICULT TO LOOK AT SOMEONE AND SAY BECAUSE THEY BOUGHT THEIRS IN 2004 IT'S ALLOWED, BUT BECAUSE THEY BOUGHT

THEIRS IN 2005 THEY CAN'T. >> THE APARTMENTS ON THE TROUBLED DISTRICT, EVIDENTLY. WE HAVE A LOT OF APARTMENTS COMING INTO OUR DISTRICT. QUITE A FEW AND STILL TO COME IN THE FUTURE I'M SURE SO I THINK THERE ARE PLENTY OF PEOPLE THAT DON'T WANT TO HAVE THE PROPERTY MAINTENANCE SO THAT'S A GOOD THING, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO BE ABLE TO KEEP SOME RURAL TOO.

WE HAVE TO. OUR COUNTY NEEDS TO PRESERVE SOME OF THAT, SO I WOULD BE IN AGREEMENT ALSO WITH STAFF.

>> AND DOES THIS HELP THIS LADY? >> YEAH.

IT WOULD HELP HER SITUATION SPECIFICALLY.

>> I LIKE THE IDEA OF WHAT YOU TALKED ABOUT WITH THE OVERLAY IF YOU ARE ABLE TO DO THAT WITH THE LA

LAKE. >> ANYONE ELSE?

>> DO YOU HAVE WHAT YOU NEED? >> THANK YOU GUYS.

I KNOW YOU PUT A LOT OF WORK INTO THAT SO THANK YOU.

[3.  Airports]

>> OKAY. ITEM THREE UNDER NEW BUSINESS IS

AIRPORTS. >> I'LL START US OFF AAND SO WE ADDED THIS ON BASED UPON THE RECENT DISCUSSION WITH REGARDS TO HOW THE COMMUNITY IS CONCERNED WITH THE AIRPORT.

OVERALL BROAD BRUSH IN RESEARCHING THIS AND TALKING TO DIFFERENT FOLKS AND F DOT. THEY HAVE A 2020 AIRPORT AIR SPACE LAND SPACE GUIDE BOOK AND IT HELPS YOU TO WRITE YOUR LAND SECHLT CODE, SO SPECIFICALLY IT USES THE CODE OF FEDERAL

[00:40:05]

LOCAL GOVERNMENT PLANNERS NEED TO UNDERSTAND SIX ITEMS OVERALL WITH REGARDS TO THIS. THE FIRST IS THAT ALL LOCAL GOVERNMENTS MUST ADOPT AIRPORT ZONING REGULATIONS.

NUMBER TWO THEY MUST ADDRESS FIVE ITEMS. PERMITTING PROCESS FOR OBSTRUCTIONS, SO JUST TO KIND OF TOUCH UPON THAT. ANYTHING AT THE END OF THE RUN WAY WOULD NEED TO BE ADDRESSED. THE PRO HIGH PICKS OF LANDFILLS NEAR THE AIRFIELD. BIRDS ARE DANGEROUS TO AIRCRAFT SO THAT'S DANGEROUS. SO THE GUIDE BOOK FOCUSES ON THAT. NUMBER THREE ON THE AREAS THAT YOU HAVE TO ADDRESS IS THE PROHIBITION OF CERTAIN LAND-USE AROUND AIRPORTS. YOU WANT TO BE A GOOD NEIGHBOR AND BE AWARE OF THE NOISE THAT YOU'RE PRODUCING AND INFLUENCING BACK THROUGHOUT THE SURROUNDING AREA.

NUMBER FOUR THE PROHIBITION OF LAND-USES IN RUNWAY PROTECTION ZONE, SO THIS IS CALLED AN R P Z.

THESE ARE ONLY CERTAIN USES. WHEN YOU DIG DOWN INTO THIS IT GETS PRETTY DETAILED. THE FDA HAS AN ADVISORY CIRCULAR NUMBER 150/1350 B AND THAT COVERED SPECIFICALLY CHAPTER THREE. INSIDE IT HAS GUIDANCE AND DISTANCE AND SAFETY AREAS ON THE PROPERTY OF THE AIRPORT AND THEN THE ROUNDING AREAS IN ORDER TO COVER THOSE YOU CAN GO INTO MATRIX AND I DUDED TO THIS BEFORE.

IT'S CALLED THE RUNWAY DESIGN MATRIX FORM AND YOU BASICALLY PUT IN THE TYPE OF AIRCRAFT YOU HAVE.

IT'S KIND OF GENERIC. OBVIOUSLY SMALLER AIRCRAFT IS LESS NOISY AND TAKES LESS AMOUNT OF AIR SPEED TO TAKE OFF.

YOUR COMMON AIRLINER AND JET WILL NEED A LOT MORE RUNWAY AND STANDARDS WITH REGARDS TO THAT AND EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT HOW NOISY THEY ARE. WITH THAT THOSE ARE THE AREAS WHEN YOU ARE WRITING THE ZONING REGULATIONS TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION. WE HAVE TALKED TO FDOT AND SPECIFICALLY THE GENTLEMEN THAT COVERS THIS AREA AND HE RECOMMENDED US TO TAKE A LOOK AT LEE COUNTY'S ZONING REGULATIONS.

IN HIS EXPERT OPINIONS THEY HAD THE BEST ONES WE COULD REFERENCE. WHEN WE TRIED TO LOOK ON OUR OWN SO YOU KNOW A LOT OF MUNICIPALITIES HAVE NOT TAKEN THIS INTO CONSIDERATION. WE'RE FORGING NEW GROUND EVEN THOUGH, IT IS A REQUIREMENT A LOT OF TIMES WHEN WE TRY TO FIND THE INFORMATION IT'S NOT READILY AVAILABLE.

THE REASON BEING IS IF YOU WERE A PUBLIC USE AIRPORT YOU RECEIVE GRANT MONEY FROM THE FFA TO OPERATE.

TO ORDER TO USE THOSE FUNDS YOU HAVE TO ADHERE TO THE RULES AND REGULATIONS. WHEN YOU ARE PRIVATE AIRPORT.

THE IT'S YOUR OWN ORGANIZATION AND YOU'RE CONDUCTING THIS HOBBY AND THIS AVIATION ASPECT ON YOUR OWN.

SO YOU ARE ABLE TO FUND IT YOURSELF AND TAKE CARE OF THAT.

HOWEVER THE OVER ARCHING UMBRELLA IS SAFETY, RIGHT? SAFETY AT THE AIRPORT AND THEN SAFETY THROUGH THE SURROUNDING AREA. WHAT I'D LIKE TO PROPOSE AND COURTNEY AND I TALKED ABOUT THIS AND SHE CAN WEIGH IN AND TALK ABOUT THE ORDINANCE OF LEE COUNTY, BUT WHAT I'M KIND OF PROPOSING IS IF WE ASK ANGELA AND HER GROUP TO ADD THIS TO THEIR SCOPE OF WORK OR WE CAN GO OUT AND GET ANOTHER ORGANIZATION

[00:45:01]

IT'S GOING TO BE NEW IN WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH THAT.

I DID ASK WGI AND IT MAY BE A GOOD POINT TO ASK THEM IF THEY HAD ANY COMMENTS. ANY COMMENTS FROM THE GROUP ON

IT? >> THE OTHER THING I'VE SEEN IS P PONS, PONDS AND WANTING TO KEEP

THE BIRDS AWAY. >> GOOD POINT.

SO ANYTHING THAT'S GOING TO ATTRACT BIRDS TO THAT PARTICULAR AREA YOU WANT TO BE COGNIZANT OF THE POND OR RIVER THAT YOU ARE NEXT TO IN THAT. ANY OTHER COMMENTS ABOUT YOUR EXPERIENCES, ANGELA PERHAPS ON WRITING THESE OR MY COMMENT THAT

THERE'S NOT VERY MANY OUT THERE? >> WE WOULD FOLLOW THE GUIDANCE AND WORK WITH STAFF TO SEE WHAT KIND OF LANGUAGE WE NEED.

>> IN THIS HANDBOOK IT'S LENGTHY AND IT DOES GREAT TO INCORPORATE THIS AND ASSIST YOU AND WE HAVE FOLLOW ON MEETINGS WITH FDA REPRESENTATIVES TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT.

I WANT TO MAKE SURE COURTNEY HAD A CHANCE TO TALK ABOUT THE ORDINANCES OR DO YOU THINK I COVERED THAT PART.

>> WE LOOKED AT THE LEE COUNTY ORDINANCE AND DID REACH OUT TO THEM. THEY HAVE TWO PUBLIC AIRPORTS, BUT THEIR GROUP WILL GET BACK WITH US BECAUSE WE SPECIFICALLY ASKED THEM. THEY HAVE MAPS ATTACHED AND WHO DREW THOSE AND WHAT CONSULTANT THEY USED.

>> THERE'S ALSO AN AIRPORT ASSOCIATION GROUP THAT WORKS WITH THE EASTERN HEIGHTS AIRPORT AUTHORITY THAT'S VERY EXPERIENCED IN AIRPORTS. THEY HAVE 30 OR 40 YEARS WITH AIRP AIRPORTS SO THEY MIGHT BE A GOOD RESOURCE. DAVID KIRKLAND IS THEIR CHAIR AND I CAN'T REMEMBER THE LEAD CONSULTANT.

>> OKAY. >> BUT I'VE MET HIM AND I THINK

HE'S MAYBE OUT OF GAINESVILLE. >> AND I THINK ONE OTHER ASPECT TO THIS IN OUR STUDIES OF THIS. THE AIRPORT DOESN'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO BE WITHIN CLAY COUNTY AND THIS IS ANOTHER ASPECT WITH THE ZONES AND OBSTRUCTIONS AND THINGS LIKE THAT AND WHAT IMPACTS US HERE IS THAT WE SHARE KEYSTONE AND THAT'S ANOTHER ASPECT. IT WILL BE A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN LEE COUNTY IN THAT AND THEN WE HAVE NAVAL JACKSONVILLE AND IT'S IMPACT IN THE AREA. NOT AS MUCH AS THE END OF THE RUNWAY, BUT I WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE TALKED ABOUT THIS.

I TALKED TO A FEW COMMISSIONERS ABOUTTH AND IT'S COME UP RECENTLY TO ADDRESS AND I CAN'T SAY WE'RE THE EXPERTS.

WE'RE TRYING TO BECOME EXPERTS IN IT AND FORGE AHEAD TO KEEP OUR COMMUNITY SAFE ACROSS THE BOARD.

PENDING THAT, THAT WAS MY BRIEF AND I THINK I COVERED MOST OF THE THINGS UP THERE AND MAYBE NOT IN ORDER.

I APOLOGIZE FOR THAT AND YEP ALL THE ITEMS ON THE SLIDE.

>> CERTAINLY THERE IS AN APPLICATION THROUGH CECILE, AS WELL THAT THE FOLKS IN FOX MEADOW HAVE GREAT CONCERNS ABOUT THE APPROACH. THEY TELL STORIES ABOUT BEING ABLE TO READ TAIL NUMBER, SO I THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT AS WELL AND I HAVE ATTENDED TWO MEETINGS ON THAT SO I DON'T HAVE A LOT OF INFORMATION, PROBABLY COMMISSIONER BOLLA COULD SPEAK MORE TO THAT, BUT THEY DID HAVE A CRASH IN FOX MEADOW YEARS AGO. IT WAS IN THE 70S, I THINK.

>> YEAH THEY'RE PRETTY ACTIVE IN THE CECILE ADVISORY BOARD.

THEY'RE MORE INTERESTED IN WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THE SPACEPORT MORE THAN ANYTHING, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF RELEVANT OVERFLOW AND IT'S SOMETHING WE SHOULD LOOK AT.

>> YES, SIR. >> I JUST HAVE A FEW COMMENTS.

AS A COUNTY MANAGER ELUDED TO THE REQUIREMENT IS TO PROVIDE SAFETY FOR THOSE ON THE AIR AND GROUND.

YOU TALK ABOUT RUNWAY PROTECTION ZONES.

[00:50:04]

WITH HIM. DO YOU REMEMBER HIS NAME?

>> JACK BUTLER. YES, SIR.

>> THAT'S NOT JUST THE ONLY PERSON THAT WE'RE CONSULTING WITH, BUT THE STAFF HAS THAT CONTACT AND WE'VE BEEN IN CONTACT WITH THEM A FEW TIMES AND WE WANT TO USE EVERY ASSET FORD TO BE ABLE MOVE FORWARD WITH IT.

>> THE LAST THING I HAVE IS THIS IS A MILITARY RETIREE COMMUNITY AND THERE'S A LOT OF EXPERIENCE IN AVIATION SITTING OUT IN THE AUDIENCE AND QUITE HONESTLY THERE'S SOME SITTING RIGHT HERE.

I WAS DISPLAYED. TODAY SCHEDULING FOR RECOMMISSIONED. DON'T FORGET INPUT FROM THE COMMUNITY. WE HAVE A LOT OF EXPERIENCE

HERE. >> YEAH I KNOW THIS IS A PERSONAL PROPERTY RIGHTS ISSUE AND DOES IT MAKE SENSE TO SITE A SCHOOL AT THE END OF THE RUNWAY. IT IS RIGHT TO TAKE SOMEBODY'S PROPERTY AND TELL THEM THEY CAN'T BUILD WHAT THEY WANT ON IT? THAT'S THE ISSUE.

SOMEWHERE IN THE MIDDLE WE HAVE TO FIND COMMON GROUND HERE.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT IS, BUT WE'RE WORKING ON IT.

WE GOT OUR BEST PEOPLE ON IT. >> WELL, I THINK IT'S IN EVERYBODY'S PER VIEW TO BUILD SOMETHING SAFE.

YOU DON'T WANT A SCHOOL AT THE END OF A RUNWAY.

THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE SO WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THE SAFETY OF THE ESTABLISHMENT AND BOTH PARTIES WE HAVE TO LOOK AT.

>> OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE ON THE AIRPORTS?

[4.  Follow-up from February Workshop (Land Development Code)]

ITEM FOUR. FOR THIS YOU HAVE RICHARD AND I AND WE'RE BRINGING THAT BACK FROM THE FEBRUARY WORKSHOP.

TO GET US ON THE SAME PAGE. SO THIS IS ESSENTIALLY PART OF THE SLIDE WE SHOWED BACK IN FEBRUARY JUST TO KIND OF GET US BACK TO WHERE WE WERE AND WHAT WE WERE DISCUSSING.

A LOT OF THE COUNTIES AROUND US HAVE NO SIZE LIMITATIONS ON THEIR STORM WATER POND. WHEN PULLING A LOT OF THIS TOGETHER AND TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE BEST AVENUE TO GO TO ATTACK THIS WE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION WITH ENGINEERING WHICH IS WHY RICHARD IS HERE TODAY.

ESSENTIALLY FROM AN ENGINEERING PERSPECTIVE THEY LIKE THE STORM WATER PONDS TO BE AS BIG AS THEY CAN.

THE BIGGER THEY ARE THE LESS FLOODING WE HAVE.

THAT WAS PART OF THE REASON WE WANTED TO BRING THIS ITEM PARTICULARLY BACK TO YOU IS BECAUSE WE HAVE SOME IDEAS ON HOW TO SOLVE THIS ISSUE AND WE'VE WANTED TO GET YOUR BLESSING TO MOVE FORWARD TO CHANGE THAT IN THE CODE.

BEFORE I GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE, RICHARD DO YOU HAVE COMMENTS?

>> THE MORE SURFACE AREA YOU HAVE THAT PROVIDES A LOT OF WATER QUALITY TREATMENT. THE OILS AND THINGS THAT COME OFF THE VEHICLES ONE OF THE BEST DISSIPATION OF THAT IS UNLIGHT EVAPORATION SO WE WANT TO NOT LIMENT THE SIZE.

MOST OF THE FOLKS BUILDING THESE HOMES OUT HERE ARE BUILDING THE STATE AND STATE JOHN'S REQUIRED MINIMUMS SO THAT'S ONE THING THAT IS KIND OF LIKE TELLING THEM THEY CAN'T GO TOO FAST.

THEY ARE BUILDING WHAT THEY HAVE TO BUILD TO GET THEIR PROPERTY PROPERLY PERMITTED. WE FEEL THERE WILL BE A WAVE OF DEVELOPMENT PARTICULARLY SOUTH OF THE COUNTY THAT COULD RISE UP TO ANOTHER LEVEL WHERE THERE COULD BE MORE AMENITIES AND I DON'T THINK WE WANT TO PUT A KINK IN THEIR ABILITY TO A MEN

[00:55:02]

>> ONE OF THE ISSUES WITH STORM WATER PONDS IS SAFETY.

IF YOU READ THE PAPER WE'VE LOST A COUPLE OF KIDS WHO HAVE DROWNED. I DON'T CARE IF IT'S THREE FEET DEEP. WHAT CONSIDERATIONS ARE WE LOOKING AT CONCERNING SAFETY OF STORM WATER PONDS?

>> AGAIN THAT'S NOT MANY FOLKS BUY A PLACE ON THE LAKE AND BUILD FAITHS BY THE WATER. IF YOU HAVE A FOUR FOOT DEEP YOU HAVE TO HAVE A FENCE. FLORIDA IS NOT LIKE THAT.

PEOPLE ARE USED TO THE WITH A BE AND YOU DON'T FENCE OFF WHAT YOU A AMENIZE.

>> ONE THING THAT I WILL SAY THAT WE ADDRESS IN THE RECREATIONAL BONDS IS THE SLOPE THOSE THINGS CAN BE BUILT TO SO THAT'S ONE THING THAT WE CAN REFER TO THAT WHEN WE WRITE THE CODE THAT THEY HAVE THE SAFEST SLOPE THAT WE CAN GET BUT IF YOU ARE TAKING A STORM WATER POND AND GOING TO TURN IT INTO A RECREATIONAL LAKE THEY WON'T WANT TO HAVE A FENCE.

>> WE CAN LOOK AT AND DECIDE WHAT TO DO, BUT TO IGNORE IT IS IRRESPONSIBLE. YOU WILL SEE ON THE TRANSPORTATION PROGRAM A LOT OF NEW PONDS ALONG THE EDGE OF ROADS LIKE COLLEGE DRIVE. THOSE WILL BE FENCED AND PROPERLY CONTROLLED. YOU DON'T WANT A PEDESTRIAN SO FALL INTO THAT, BUT IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS AND ALL THAT WILL BE ONE THAT WILL BE A TOUGH SELL.

>> WELL I JUST THINK WE OUGHT TO LOOK AT IT AND CONSIDER IT INSTEAD OF SAYING WELL ALONG COLLINS DRIVE WE'RE GOING TO DO IT AND THEN WE'RE NOT, DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

>> I THINK ALL OF THOSE WILL BE BY ROADWAYS.

WE'LL LOOK INTO IT. TERESA, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE? ESSENTIALLY WHAT WE THINK WE NEED TO DO TO TACKLE THE ISSUE WITH STORM WATER PONDS IS ON THIS SLIDE.

WE DON'T HAVE A STORM WATER DEFINITION WITH CRITERIA AND WE NEED TO ADD AN APPLICATION. ST. JOHN'S RIVER HAS THAT APPLICATION SO WE CAN MIRROR AFTER THEIRS AND WORK IN TANDEM WITH THEM. WE ALSO NEED TO ADD A RECREATIONAL LAKE BECAUSE PART OF WHAT WE SEE SOME OF THE DEVELOPERS TODAY ARE LOOKING TO CHARGE MORE FOR THEIR LOTS USING A STORM WATER POND AND TURNING IT INTO AMENITY OR RECREATIONAL LAKE AS THEY GET FURTHER IN THEIR DEVELOPMENT.

WE CAN ADD LIMITS TO TIMES AS TO WHEN YOU CAN WORK OUT THERE INCLUDING DAILY WORK HOURS. WE HAVE WEEKENDS VERSES WEEKDAY WORK HOURS AND ARTICLE TWO CAN REFLECT REQUIRED VERSES STORM WATER RULES SO IF YOU GUYS ARE OKAY THESE ARE THE THINGS WE'D LIKE TO BRING BACK IN DRAFT FORM IN OUR CODE IN OCTOBER.

WE'LL ADD SAFETY TO THE LIST COMMISSIONER RENNIGER AND IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE ON THAT LIST?

>> I'D LIKE A DEFINITION OF RECREATION? IS IT FISHING? JET SKIING?

>> IT COULD BE BOTH IF IT'S BIG ENOUGH.

>> THAT'S WHAT I THINK WE NEED TO DEFINE WHAT RECREATION IS AUTHORIZED IN A DEVELOPMENT. I DON'T KNOW.

>> OKAY. >> WHAT CONSIDERATIONS YOU WOULD

HAVE FOR A JET SKI LAKE. >> COULD YOU ALSO TAKE A LOOK AT THE WORK HOURS FOR ABOROUGH PIT AND THE WORK HOURS FOR AN AGRICULTURE POND. I'VE GOTTEN A LOT OF COMPLAINTS.

OUR CULTURE POND THAT'S BEING USED AS A BURROW PIT AND THEY START AT 6:00 A.M. AND THE REST OF ANY BUSINESS IN CLAY COUNTY CAN'T START UNTIL 7:00 A.M. SO ANYWAY CAN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THAT WHEN YOU GO TO THAT. I DON'T CARE HOW YOU ADDRESS THEM, BUT I DO CARE A LOT THAT YOU ADDRESS THE LOOPHOLES.

I KNOW SHE SAID I CAN'T DO EVERYTHING I WANT TO DO, BUT IN MY DISTRICT THERE'S ONE THAT IS, I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT ENDED UP.

STORM WATER POND, AMENITY LAKE AND WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE 29 HIGH

[01:00:02]

THEY CAN HAVE A LAKE, I'M NOT SUGGESTING THEY CAN'T, BUT TO LOOK HOW IT GOES OVERALL, THE DIFFERENT TRIBUTARIES AND THINGS UNDER THE GROUND, THOSE ARE THE LOOPHOLES I'M LOOKING TO CLOSE.

AND WE HAD ANOTHER SITUATION COME UP IN COMMISSIONER BURKE'S DISTRICT THIS YEAR THAT WAS OF A CONCERN THAT THEY WOULD END UP DOING THE SAME THING. NOT THE SAME PERSON.

>> OKAY. GOT THEM ALL.

ANYBODY ELSE? >> WE NEED SOME TIME CONSTRAINTS

ON DIGGING THESE HOLES. >> YES, SIR.

>> TWO YEARS IS TOO LONG. >> WHAT WE HAVE ON THE BARE PITS IS A YEAR. WE HAVE A YEAR TIMEFRAME BUT THEY CAN COME BACK AND REOPEN IT, BUT WE'D HAVE TO GET A PROGRESS REPORT BEFORE THEY COULD.

>> IN MY DISTRICT A GUY DIDN'T HAVE A PERMIT SO HE STARTED TO DIG AND I GOT COMPLAINTS AND WE WENT IN AND HE FINALLY GOT A PERMIT FOR WHATEVER HE WAS BUILDING, A LAKE OR A POND AND THEN HE STARTS TO DUMP WASTE IN IT FROM THE STUFF THEY DUGOUT AND PUT IT BACK AND FILLED IT BACK UP AND THEN WE GOT A COMPLAINT ON THAT SO HE HAD TO GET ANOTHER PERMIT.

THEY'RE GAMING US AND BEATING US, OKAY?

>> YEAH THAT BRINGS UP GOOD QUESTION.

BECAUSE I HAVE ONE IN MY DISTRICT THAT WAS BUILT TOTALLY LEGALLY. SO THERE'S ONE IN SEAMAN COVE THAT BLACKS UP TO BLACK PARK ROAD.

A TOTALLY ILLEGAL POND. HE'S IN TROUBLE, BUT THEY'RE MOVING AT A SNAIL PACE SO DO WE HAVE SOME WAY TO PUT IN PENALTIES IN OUR CODE? YOU HAD A SIMILAR ISSUE IN THE LAST MEETING ABOUT THE BULKHEAD, THE GENTLEMEN THAT BUILT THAT, WHAT DO WE DO ONCE IT'S DONE? I KNOW IT'S NOT THE SAME, BUT IS THERE A WAY THAT YOU CAN LOOK AT WHAT WE DO IF THEY JUST GO AHEAD

AND DO THAT. >> IT'S UNPERMITTED STRUCTURES.

DO WE ADDRESS THAT IN THE CODE? >> WE DO.

>> REMEDIATION OF UNPERMITTED STRUCTURE?

>> YES, PENALTIES. >> IT'S GOT TO BE WORTH A LOT RIGHT NOW FOR THE HIGHWAY PROJECT.

>> IS THERE NOT A TIME LIMIT ON BAR PIT THEN?

>> I'LL HAVE TO LOOK. I HEARD FIVE YEARS FROM A BIRD CHIRPING BEHIND ME. MOST OF YOU WEREN'T HERE, BUT WE TOTALLY REWORKED THE BORROWED PIT AND WE PUT A LOT MORE REGULATIONS AND FENCES AND SIGNAGE, WORKING TIME, OPERATIONAL TIMES, WE PUT THE FIVE YEAR TIMEFRAME IN PLACE WHERE IF THEY LAST MORE THAN FIVE YEARS THEY HAVE TO COME IN

AND GIVE US A PROGRESS REPORT. >> ARE YOU SAYING A FENCE HAS TO

BE AROUND IT? >> YES.

>> THE ONE ON AND IS RIDGE DOES NOT HAVE ONE?

>> BUT IF IT IS A LIVESTOCK POND.

>> OR A STORM WATER POND. >> A DIFFERENT SET OF RAGS.

[01:05:04]

>> WHAT ABOUT A STRIP MINE? >> THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING

ABOUT. >> TAKING DIRT OUT TO CALL IT A

STRIP MINE FOR DIRT. >> BOTTOM LINE IS HAVING DEFINITIONS I THINK WILL HELP. I ALSO THINK HAVING STANCE FROM ST. JOHN'S WATER MANAGEMENT. THE AMENITY THAT COMMISSIONER CONDON IS TALKING ABOUT AND WE ALL KNOW WHICH ONE THAT IS AND IT WOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN BUILT IF THEY HADN'T COME UP WITH THE GAME PLAN TO PUT HOUSING AROUND IT.

WE NEVER WOULD HAVE APPROVED OF THAT FACILITY THERE.

LET'S LOOK AT IT AS IT'S INTENDED TO BE SO WHAT HAPPENS WHEN WE SAY ONE THING AND ST. JOHN'S SAYS ANOTHER.

HOW DO WE COORDINATE TO MAKE SURE THEY LOOK AT OUR WISHES? I KNOW THERE'S NO ANSWER. BUT JUST THE FACE YOU MADE WAS

ENOUGH FOR ME. >> OKAY.

>> AND GOING BACK TO THE POND, 260 ACRES? 64 FEET DEEP? THEY WERE TURNED DOWN UNANIMOUSLY AND THEY COME OUT WITH AN ALTERNATE TO PUT 28 HOUSES IN THE MIX AND ALL OF THE SUDDEN WE DON'T HAVE SAY IN THE OVERSIGHT SO WE REALLY NEED TO DEFINE.

I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PEOPLE DOING WHAT THEY NEED TO DO, BUT WE'VE HAD A LOT OF INSTANCE WHERE'S 50% THROUGH IT'S HIKE WE CAN MAKE A LOT OF MONEY WITH HOUSES.

NOW IT'S A RECREATIONAL FACILITY AND WE KNOW THAT'S NOT REALLY THE CASE, SO YEAH HAVING DEFINITIONS WOULD HELP US GO A LONG TIME. THIS IS ONE OF THE MORE DISAPPOINTING MOMENTS OF HAVING THE NEIGHBORS AND THE PEOPLE AT THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA AND PROFESSORS INVOLVED WITH PONDS AND WETLANDS ALL SAYING IT IS A BAD IDEA AND WE HAVE NO ABILITY

TO STOP IT. >> RIGHT.

>> SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE TRYING TO CREATE OUR OWN STORM WATER

APPLICATION. >> JUST LIKE THE RV FACILITY THAT WE KNOW WILL NEVER GET VACATED.

>> IT'S WRONG THOUGH NOW. THEY CAN DRIVE FROM KEYSTONE NOW

TO 17 AND THEN BACK. >> OR STOP AT THE FAIRGROUNDS,

ONE IN BETWEEN. >> A LOT OF AREAS FOR THEM TO

GO. >> THAT ONE IS STILL AHEAD ACHE COMMISSIONER CELLA AND I'M SURE THEY WANT TO SOLVE THIS AS THEY CAN STOP HEARING FROM ME AND MORE IMPORTANTLY THE RESIDENTS BECAUSE THAT'S WHOSE PAYING PRICE.

>> DID WE GART ARMS AROUND THE DEPTH ISSUE? THE 15 FEET? IF IT'S OVER A KID'S NOSE IT

WILL NOT MATTER. >> TO BE HONEST WE DON'T HAVE A DEFINITE ANSWER BECAUSE SOME OF THE STUFF WE HEAR IS DUVALL'S IS 15, BUT WE HAVE HEARD FROM SOME DEVELOPERS THAT THEY DON'T PAY ATTENTION TO THAT AND WE'VE BEEN TOLD WITH ST. JOHN'S RIVER AND I'M GOING TO GET THIS TITLE WRONG, BUT YOU CAN FILL OUT SOME ANAEROBIC CALCULATION, AND IT'LL HELP YOU DIG DEEPER.

>> DEEPER THAN 12 FEET AND THEY HAVE NEVER DENIED ONE SO IT'S NOT REALLY A REGULATION, BUT IT HAS DO WITH THE QUALITY OF THE WATER. THERE'S AN IN VERSION IN FLORIDA LAKES THAT CAN CREATE A FISH KILL AND THE ENGINEER BIOLOGIST HAS TO PROVE THAT WON'T HAPPEN. FROM OUR UNDERSTANDING THEY DON'T DENY THAT. THE MANAGEMENT DENY THAT.

>> THE ONE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, WHO KNOWS HOW DEEP IT IS.

WE HAVE NO PERMIT ON THAT ONE. >> IRONICALLY ENOUGH DEP WAS OUT THERE ON ISSUE THIS WEEK AND SOME OF THE STAFFERS ACTED LIKE THEY HAD NO IDEA THAT ONE WAS THERE WHICH THEY WERE INVOLVED IN AND TOLD THE RESIDENTS TO MAKE A FORMAL COMPLAINT ON THE WEBSITE AND I KNOW THAT THE STORM WATER MANAGEMENT, SOMEONE FROM THEIR OFFICE WAS INSPECTING OUT THERE RECENTLY SO HOPEFULLY THEY ARE PAYING ATTENTION. I BELIEVE THE NEW MANAGEMENT IS PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT THE PERMIT REQUIREMENTS ARE.

ONE OF THE PERMIT REQUIREMENTS IS TO REMOVE THE EASY BASE.

THEY DID NOT. ASIDE FROM THAT I DON'T HAVE SPECIFICS OF WHAT HEY, THEY HAVE NOT DONE BUT IF WE CAN WORK MORE

[01:10:07]

>> I THINK WE HAVE OUR LIST. >> THANK YOU.

>> NARROW LOTS? >> SO WITH NARROW LOTS WE TALKED ABOUT THAT IN THE FEBRUARY WORKSHOP AND WE'VE HAD LOTS OF DISCUSSION WITH THAT. ONE THING YOU ASKED US TO DO WITHIN THE WORKSHOP IS HAVE CONVERSATIONS WITH THE BUILDER WHICH IS WE DID THAT, JESSE AND SOME OF HIS TEAM ARE HERE TODAY SO THEY MAY HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT AT THE END.

WE HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH THEM VIA E-MAIL ON STUFF THEY LIKE AND DON'T LIKE ON WHAT WE PROPOSED.

ESSENTIALLY WE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT NARROW LOTS SPECIFICALLY IN PUDS. ONE THING WE TALKED ABOUT IS LIMITING THE AMOUNT OF PUDS OR 40 FOOT LOTS IN A PUD.

AS WE REALLY DUG INTO THIS AND HAD A LOT OF CONVERSATIONS IT IS A LOT LIKE THE STORM WATER WE THINK THERE'S OTHER THINGS WE CAN ADDRESS IN OUR CODE THAT WOULD REDUCE TISSUES WITH 40 FOOT LOTS AND ALL OF OUR LOTS AND THOSE HAVE DO WITH WORKING AND RECREATIONAL SPACE SO ESSENTIALLY THERE'S PROS AND CONS. A LOT OF PEOPLE LIKE THE 40 FOOT LOTS BECAUSE IT'S LESS LOT TO DEAL WITH AND THAT'S AN EASIER KEEP AND THAT'S YOUR CON, AS WELL IF YOU HAVE A 40 FOOT LOT AND YOU WANT TO PUT A POOL OR SHED IN YOUR BACK YARD YOU MIGHT BE OUT OF LUCK. DODDIE HAS INFORMATION TO SHARE AND WE WILL TAKE NOTES AND WE DO HAVE A SUGGESTION SLIDE AT THE END SO IF YOU WILL BEAR WITH US FOR A FEW MINUTES AND THEN WE'LL TAKE NOTES AND BRING THAT BACK TO YOU, AS WELL.

YOU RUN. >> YOU CAN ADVANCE.

SO FROM THE PREVIOUS WORKSHOP IN FEBRUARY WE IDENTIFIED THAT PARKING WAS A SIGNIFICANT ISSUE IN THESE NARROWER LOTS.

PRIMARILY IN THE STREET AND OVER THE SIDEWALK, AND THEN IN STAFF LOOKING AT THIS WE IDENTIFIED RECREATION AS INCONSISTENCY IN HOW WE IDENTIFY METHODOLOGY FOR RECREATION SPACE REQUIRED.

THE TWO MASTER PLANS ARE VERY SIMILAR IN HOW THEY ADDRESS THIS HOWEVER THE PUD ZONING CODE IS CONSIDERABLY DIFFERENT SO STAFF FEELS WE NEED TO CONSOLIDATE THAT AND HAVE A CONSISTENT METHODOLOGY ACROSS EVERYTHING SO THAT'S ONE THING WE WANT TO LOOK AT. NEXT SLIDE SO HERE'S TWO PICTURES AND THESE ARE TWO DIFFERENT PLACES NOT IN CLAY COUNTY, BUT THEY ILLUSTRATE SOME OF THE ISSUES INVOLVED AND CAN I GRAB THE CLICKER? SORRY.

>> I DON'T THINK IT WORKS. >> SO OBVIOUSLY ON THE RIGHT WE HAVE A PICTURE OF SOMEBODY PARKING OVER THE SIDEWALK.

THESE ARE ATTACHED HOMES, BUT IT'S THE SAME ISSUE.

THEY ARE THERE AND THERE'S NOT ENOUGH ROOM UNLESS ONE IS IN THE GARAGE AND THE PARKING SPOT ON THE LOT, SO THE RESULT IS WE ALL HAVE STUFF IN OUR GARAGES AND SO IF WE'RE USING IT THAT WAY WE NEED TWO SPOTS THAT ARE ON THE LOT AND NOT FORCING SOMEBODY TO BE OUT IN THE STREET. THE EXAMPLE ON THE LEFT IS AND AERIAL SHOWING YOU 40 FOOT LOTS THAT IF YOU LIVE IN ONE OF THE HOUSES IN THE CENTER. THERE'S GOOD SIDEWALK ACTIVITY ON THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE BUT IF YOU LIVE THERE YOU'RE ACCESSING YOUR GARAGE FROM THE BACK A LEE WHICH IS FINE, BUT THAT DOES NOT PROVIDE ANY KIND OF PARKING IN A DRIVE WAY SO YOU HAVE TO PARK IN THE GARAGE AND THAT WOULDN'T NECESSARILY BE AN ISSUE IF YOU

[01:15:03]

THANK YOU. APPRECIATE THAT.

SO THERE'S ONE DRIVE WAY THAT ACTUALLY HAS SPACE TO PARK A VEHICLE IN IT, BUT THE REST ARE TOO NARROW.

MAYBE FIVE OR SIX FEET OR SO. IF YOU HAVE TEENAGERS OR YOUNG ADULTS THAT ARE IN COLLEGE, BUT STILL LIVING AT HOME, OR YOUR PARENTS LIVE WITH YOU BUT IF YOU HAVE A NEED FOR MORE THAN TWO VEHICLES YOU ARE OUT OF LUCK AS TO WHERE YOU ARE GOING TO PARK HERE OR EVEN HAVING FRIENDS OVER FOR DINNER.

WHERE ARE THEY GOING TO PARK? IF DEVELOPMENT DOESN'T TAKE THAT NEED FOR ADDITIONAL PARKING BEYOND TWO VEHICLES OR VISITOR PARKING INTO ACCOUNT YOU WIND UP WITH THESE PROBLEMS. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. THERE ARE WAYS TO HAVE NARROW LOTS AND PROVIDE PARKING. I HAVE OPTIONS HERE.

THIS IS A PROJECT THAT HAPPENS TO BE IN ORANGE COUNTY.

THIS IS THE BACK OF THE HOUSE SO THERE'S 42 FOOT DRIVEWAY HERE.

THE PREVIOUS LOT WAS 40 AND THIS IS 45.

THE HOUSE IS THIS ONE HERE IN THE MIDDLE.

THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE HERE IS A GOOD SIDEWALK CONNECTIVITY.

YOU CAN'T SEE THIS, BUT THERE'S A PARK RIGHT HERE OFF SCREEN WITH VISITOR TYPE PARKING AROUND IT.

THESE ARE TOWN HOMES ON THIS OTHER SIDE AND OPPOSITE THEM THEY FRONT ON TO A BOULEVARDED STREET WITH ON STREET PARKING SO IF YOU HAVE GUESTS AND YOU LIVE HERE, THERE ARE PUBLIC PARKING AREAS NEAR THE HOUSE AND THE RESIDENT DRIVES AROUND AND AGAIN IT'S BACK ALLEY ACCESS TO THE GARAGE IN ADDITION TO TWO.

THIS OPTION REQUIRES SLIGHTLY WIDER LOT.

THIS IS A 54 FOOT LOT AND THESE ARE SIDE DRIVEWAYS.

THE ADVANTAGE THERE IS ALTHOUGH THEY DON'T HAVE ON STREET PARKING YOU CAN SEE HERE THERE'S TWO CARS.

REAR GARAGES AND SO YOU HAVE TWO IN THE GARAGE AND TWO HERE AND YOU CAN GET THREE OR FOUR MAYBE SO IF YOU HAVE A PARTY FOR DINNER OR THE KIDS CAME HOME FOR THE WEEKEND OR WHATEVER YOU CAN PETTY MUCH ACCOMMODATE MOST OF THE PARKING NEEDS ON THE LOT FOR THE HOUSE WITHOUT ADDITIONAL PARKING OUTSIDE.

AND THESE ARE TWO OTHER EXAMPLES OF OPTIONS.

THE PHOTO IS RIGHT-OF-WAY WHERE YOU HAVE A SIDEWALK, ON STREET TREES AND ON STREET PARKING AND BICYCLE LANE AND THREE TRAVEL LANE SO IF YOUR RIGHT OF WAY IS SUFFICIENT YOU CAN PROVIDE A LOT OF ON STREET PARKING AND ON THE AERIAL ON THE RIGHT SIDE THESE ARE CLUSTERS OF VISITOR PARK. THERE'S SEVEN OR EIGHT HERE THAT CAN PROVIDE PARKING FOR THIS WHOLE GROUP.

YOU HAVE FRONT SIDEWALK ACCESS FROM PEDESTRIAN TO THE HOME.

YOU DRIVE AROUND AND ACCESS THE HOME FROM THE BACK ALLEY.

JUST BARELY, BUT DRIVEWAY SPACES IN ADDITION SO YOU HAVE FOUR ON AND THEN THESE VISITORS THERE'S ANOTHER CLUSTER HERE FOR THE GROUP OF HOMES TO THE SOUTH AND HERE AND YOU DO THAT DISPERSED THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY. SO WE LOOKED AT OUR CURRENT ZONING CODE AND ALL THE SINGLE HOUSING FAMILY DISTRICTS- ARE ON THE LEFT, AND THEN THE LOT WIDTH IS ON THE RIGHT.

THE FIRST HALF OF THE LIST ARE AREAS OUTSIDE THE MASTER PLAN AND THERE'S TWO LOT WIDTHTH ISES.

100 FEET AND 60. THIS NO WIDTH SET BY YOU AS THE BOARD APPROVING APPLICATIONS OR WHATEVER COMES FORWARD.

THE LOW P.D. ARE MASTER PLANS AND IN BRANCH THEN FIELD THERE'S A VILLAGE ZONE AND THEY RANGE FROM 32 UP TO 58 FEET.

THE MASTER PLAN REQUIRES TWO DIFFERENT LOT SIZES FOR EACH DEVELOPMENT TO PROVIDE VARIETY. BREN THEN FIELD HAS 75 PERCENT OF THE DEVELOPMENT THAT IS ALLOWED TO HAVE THE SMALLER LOT SIZE OF THE TWO ALLOWED SO 25 PERCENT CAN BE HIGHER.

[01:20:03]

THEY LIMIT A MAXIMUM OF 20% OF THE SUBDIVISION LOTS TO THE SMALLER SIZE AND REQUIRE 80 PERCENT SO IT IS A FLIP FLOP.

THERE'S NO RIGHT OR WRONG, BUT THE IDEA IS TO PROMOTE WALKABILITY. THAT'S WHERE BRENNEN FEELS THE FOCUS WAS. WE LOOKED AT WHAT WE HAVE BUILT CURRENTLY. COULD NOT FIND ANY EXAMPLES OF 30-FOOT LOTS BUILT TO DATE. WE HAVE A NUMBER OF 40 FOOT LOTS. THIS HAPPENS TO BE UP IN OAK CLIFF AND THESE ARE 44 FOOT LOTS UP HERE AND THESE HAVE FRONT DRIVEWAYS AND THEY DO PROVIDE TWO SPACES IN THE DRIVEWAY AND THESE SURROUND THIS PARK AND AROUND THE PARK IS ALL THESE VISITOR SPACES AND THOSE PROVIDE THIS AND THESE ARE ATTACHED HOMES WITH FRONT SIDEWALKS AND A BACK ALLEY KIND OF ARRANGEMENT.

THIS IS ALSO OAK CLIFF BUTTON OPPOSITE SIDE.

THIS AREA WE HAVE SIDE DRIVES WITH THE GARAGES IN THE REAR AND MOST OF THOSE WOULD PROBABLY ACCOMMODATE ABOUT FIVE TO SIX, MAYBE A COUPLE MORE PARKING SPACES.

THESE ARE 50 FOOT LOTS AND I JUST HAPPEN TO PASS OVER A GOOD EXAMPLE OF FOUR CARS IN THE DRIVEWAY.

THESE ALL FIT, BUT ONLY BECAUSE THERE'S NO SIDEWALK.

ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE YOU DO HAVE A SIDEWALK.

NEXT SLIDE. THESE AGAIN JUST FURTHER SOUTH AND I RAN ACROSS THIS EXAMPLE. IT IS A 60 FOOT LOT WHICH WE'RE NOT CONSIDERING NOW, BUT YOU'LL NOTICE THAT A LOT OF THE RESIDENTS HAVE EXPANDED THEIR DRIVEWAY WIDTH AND I THOUGHT IT WAS INDICATIVE OF, WE NEED MORE THAN TWO CARS IN OUR DRIVEWAY.

>> THE STREET IS NARROW. YES.

YOU CAN'T PARK ON THE STREET THERE.

>> YOU PUT TWO CARS ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE STREET YOU

CAN'T GET THROUGH. >> THAT'S WHY WE LIKE THE 12

FOOT LANES THAT WE REQUIRE. >> SO WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO IS BRING YOU A SERIES OF OPTIONS FOR DEVELOPMENT TO OCCUR TO PROVIDE THE PARKING WE ALL KNOW WE NEED.

THIS IS KIND OF A LIST OR SELECTION OF POSSIBLE WAYS TO ADDRESS IT. WE DON'T WANT TO SAY YOU CAN ONLY DO THIS ONE WAY. WE WANT TO SEE A VARIETY OF DEVELOPMENTS HAPPENING IN THE COUNTY.

WHETHER FOUR SPACES IN YOUR DRIVEWAY OR YOU ARE PROVIDING THEM IN THE REAR OR THE FRONT. ON STREET PARKING AND CLUSTERED VISITOR PARKING. WE'D LIKE TO PROVIDE THOSE OPTIONS AND ADDRESS THE RECREATIONAL ISSUE AND NEXT SLIDE IF YOU WOULD PLEASE SO AS WE SAID, THE PRIOR BOARD WORKSHOP THAT WAS SUGGESTING WE GO WITH 20% MAXIMUM IN THE PUDS TO MATCH LIKE WHAT ALLOWED WITH THE LAKE, BUT AFTER LOOKING AT ALL OF THESE THINGS WE'D LIKE TO RECOMMEND OPTION THREE WHICH WOULD BE TO AMEND ALL OF OUR ZONING TO REALLY DEAL WITH THE ROOT ISSUE WHICH IS NOT REALLY THE NUMBER OF LOTS THAT ARE NARROW, BUT THE PARKING THAT GOES WITH THAT AND THE RECOMMENDATION. AND WE OFFER THE OPTION OF MAYBE CREATING NARROW LOT SUBDIVISION SPECIFIC TO THESE ISSUES AND WHETHER OR NOT YOU WOULD FEEL THAT WOULD APPLY TO ALL THE URBAN SERVICE AREA OR IN IT, BUT OUTSIDE THE MASTER PLAN.

STAFF DOESN'T HAVE A REAL FEEL ONE WAY OR THE OTHER ON THAT, BUT LEAVE THAT TO YOUR RECOMMENDATION AND DIRECTION THAT WE WOULD BRING BACK SOMETHING IN OCTOBER FOR YOU, IF

[01:25:02]

IT'S A LOT. >> WELL I DON'T LIKE 40 FOOT LOTS. I HAVE A LOT OF THAT IN OAK LEAF. IT WAS DEVELOPED WITH GREAT BOULEVARDS AND THEN YOU GET INTO THE ACTUAL COMMUNITIES AND THERE'S NOWHERE TO PARK ANYWHERE.

THE PUBLIC PARKING KIND OF THING, I WOULD IMAGINE TELLING YOUR IN-LAWS THAT THEY HAVE TO PARK A BLOCK AND A HALF AWAY TO COME OVER. THEY'RE GOING TO PARK IN FRONT OF THE HOUSE. THAT'S HOW THAT'S GOING TO WORK.

I LIKE THE IDEA OF HAVING ENOUGH PARKING IN THE DRIVEWAYS TO MAKE THE SIDEWALKS ACCESSIBLE, AS WELL.

THAT'S A GREAT IDEA. I DON'T LIKE THE IDEA OF HAVING FIVE FEET BETWEEN GUTTERS ON HOUSES THOUGH.

THAT MAKES IT LOOK LIKE A SLUM. YOU FEEL LIKE SOMETHING IS GOING TO FALL ON YOU. I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY APPROPRIATE FOR A-TOWN HOUSE SITUATION WHERE YOU HAVE, AGAIN A COUPLE OF STORIES UP AND YOU HAVE NARROW STUFF BETWEEN HOUSES, BUT THEY ARE CONSIDERED TO BE A DIFFERENT ANIMAL THAN A SINGLE FAMILY HOUSE. THAT'S MY FEEL.

THE WIDER STREETS HAVE DEFINITELY HELPED WITH THIS ISSUE, BUT YOU BUILD THESE COMMUNITIES AND THE DEVELOPER WILL TELL YOU THAT PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO BUY WITH BIG LOTS.

THEY'RE JUST TRYING TO GET AS MANY HOUSES JAMMED IN THERE'S A THEY CAN. TO MAKE IT LOOK REASONABLE I'VE ALWAYS THOUGHT 50 FEET IS KIND OF MY MENTAL MINIMUM, BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE IS PROBABLY A REASON FOR 40 FOOT LOTS IN SOME CASES. I LIKE SAYING ONLY 10 OR 20% CAN BE 40 FOOT, BUT WITH APPROPRIATE SETBACKS AND ENOUGH PARKING AROUND THERE SO WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THEM FALLING OUT ON THE STREET OR ANYTHING ELSE. I KNOW A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T PARK IN THEIR GARAGE. THAT'S PRETTY COMMON.

THERE'S NOT ENOUGH STORAGE WHICH IS A HOLE OTHER ISSUE.

I GAVE MY BASEMENT UP, BUT NOW I HAVE ANOTHER PIECE OF PROPERTY.

SO THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS. COMMISSIONER CELLA?

>> I NEVER LIKED 40 FOOT LOTS. YOU CAN GO BACK TO THE NEIGHBORHOODS BEFORE WE PASSED AN ORDINANCE TO GO TO THE WIDER STREETS. THE 24 FOOT STREETS AND THEY ARE A MESS. GO IN ON A SATURDAY NIGHT OR SUNDAY MORNING AND EVERYONE IS HOME AND THERE'S CARS IN THE ROADWAY AND THEY'RE ALL 40 FOOT LOTS.

THAT'S WHERE THE PREMISE STARTED FOR ME AND I DO A LOT OF SPEAKING TO REALTOR GROUPS AND I GIVE THEM THE UNOFFICIAL SURVEY AT SOME POINT DURING THE DAY AND ASK HOW MANY OF YOUR CUSTOMERS WANT 40 FOOT LOT, SO I DON'T THINK IT'S SO MUCH BUTTON BUILDER SIDE I'D LIKE TO HEAR MORE FROM THEM TO MAKE A DETERMINATION AS TO WHAT THEY RUN INTO I AND IT'S ALL ABOUT COST BUT WHEN YOU LOOK DOWN THE LINE YOU WANT TO BE PROUD OF THAT NEIGHBORHOOD AND RIGHT NOW THOSE 40 FOOT LOT NEIGHBORHOODS WITH THE SKINNY STREETS YOU CAN'T BE PROUD OF THOSE.

I LIKE THE IDEA THAT WE HAVE OPTIONS IN TERMS OF TRYING, WILL THE COST GO UP? LIKELY, BUT THE QUALITY OF WHAT PEOPLE BUY IS IMPORTANT, AS WELL.

WHEN YOU SQUEEZE 40 FOOT LOTS ON TOP OF EACH OTHER, THE LAND BETWEEN THE HOMES STAYS SWAMPY. EVEN IF YOU PUT GUTTERS BETWEEN THE HOUSES AN NOT EVERYBODY DOES YOU ARE STILL DUMPING WATER SO IT BEGS THE QUESTION IF ANYBODY IS EVEN USING YARDS.

THE BACK WATER IS USUALLY WHERE THE WATER GOES.

THEN KIDS ARE UP TO THEIR ANKLES IN MUD BECAUSE THEY HAVEN'T FIGURED OUT HOW TO GET RID OF THE WATER.

THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT HAVE TO BE DECIDED ON WHEN YOU BUILD 40 FOOT LOTS. I THINK IT'S A CHALLENGE TO COME UP WITH MAYBE OUTSIDE OF THE BOX OR INSTEAD OF INDIVIDUAL HOMES MAYBE THEY ARE VILLAS AND YOU HAVE THOSE ON A 70 FOOT LOT AND

[01:30:05]

THEY'RE AS POPULAR AS SINGLE FAMILY IF NOT MORE SO BECAUSE YOU HAVE SOME LANDSCAPING AND SOME THINGS TAKEN CARE OF AND THERE C PLENTY OF ROOM FOR PEOPLE TO PARK NOT ON THE STREET. SO IT BEHOOVES US TO LOOK AT THIS AND SOMEONE THOUGHTS AND WORK WITH YOU KNOW OUR PARTNERS AND BUILDERS AND DEVELOPERS WORKING THERE AND WE WANT NEIGHBORHOODS TO SUSTAIN THE QUALITY THAT THEY HAVE RIGHT IN THE BEGINNING SO YOU KNOW I LIKE THAT.

I HIKE THE IDEA, AND I KNOW IN OAK LEAF IS IT HAMILTON THAT HAS THE DRIVEWAYS ON THE SIDE AND THE GARAGE IN THE BACK?

>> YES. >> SO I'M NOT TIED TO ANYONE PARTICULAR IDEA. I DON'T PLAN TO BE A DEVELOPER OR BUILDER, BUT I DO THINK IN TALKING TO ENOUGH PEOPLE THAT PEOPLE WANT SOMETHING A LITTLE MORE, I DON'T WANT TO SAY SPACIOUS, BUT YOU WANT TO BE ABLE TO DRIVE DOWN THE STREET AND NOT THINK EVERYBODY IS ARMS LENGTH.

>> JUST TO AMPLIFY. NARROW LOTS YOU DON'T GET TO USE THAT LAND IN BETWEEN ANYWAY. IT'S ROOF RUN-OFF OR SOMETHING.

IT CREATE AS A BUILDING PROBLEM. YOU GET GROWTH ON SIDE OF YOUR BUILDING. THE OTHER THING IS WE HAVE TO MAKE THE DRIVEWAYS LONG ENOUGH. PARKING ON THE STREET IS NOT AN OPTION UNLESS YOU HAVE ACTUAL PARKING SPOTS DESIGNATED WITH OUR 20TON FIRE TRUCKS AND EVEN 12 FOOT STREETS CREATES A HAZARD. WE HAVE TO ACCOMMODATE ON PROPERTY PARKING AND FOUR CARS MINIMUM.

A DOUBLE CAR DRIVE WHERE YOU CAN PARK TWO CARS THERE.

WITHOUT IT IMPINGING AND I'M NOT OPPOSED TO SOME LEVEL OF SMALLER

LOTS, BUT 10%, 5%, 2%, MAYBE. >> I KNOW WHEN WE SPOKE, STAFF YOU SAID THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO COME TO US ANYWAY FOR OUR VOTE SO EVEN IF WE DIDN'T SAY OR TOTALLY LIMIT THAT WE WOULD ACTUALLY HAVE A SAY SO AT THAT POINT.

>> THE PUD IS IT'S OWN ZONING. >> ANYTHING GOES THAT WE ALLOW.

>> THE IDEA OF ASKING MORE RECREATION SPACE I DON'T THINK

IS A GREAT IDEA. >> THAT'S THE CHANGES WE INTEND

TO MAKE. >> TO COMMISSIONER CELLA'S POINT DEFINITELY THINKING OF OUR KIDS COMING HOME AND YOU WANT IT TO LOOK NICE AND TO BE PROUD OF IT AND THAT'S A BIG DEAL TO ME.

>> I WOULD BE RE-MISSED IF I DIDN'T GIVE MR. CHAMBLESS, ALL THESE PLACES NEED FOR PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO PRACTICE THEIR CIVIL DUTIES. IT'S BECOMING HARDER AND HARDER FOR HIM TO FIND PRECINCT LOCATIONS SO IF YA'LL CAN ADDRESS THAT WITH THIS STUFF IT WOULD MAKE HIS LIFE BETTER WHICH

MAKES OUR LIVES BETTER. >> I HAVE ONE MORE THING.

THIS IS WHERE I CAN BRING THE SHED DEAL?

>> YEAH YOU COULD. >> SO WE HAVE AT THE LAKE WE HAVE SO MANY SMALL LOTS WITH THE AMOUNT OF HOMES THAT ARE ALLOWED SO I HAD A RESIDENT CALL ME THAT WANTS A SHED.

SO THERE'S RULES FOR THAT. I GUESS THE RULE IS 7 FOOT OFF THE PROPERTY LINE. YOU HAVE I DON'T KNOW FIVE HOMES ON AN ACRE SO THIS SHED WILL END UP IN THE MIDDLE OF HIS BACKYARD, AND IF YOU THINK ABOUT SOMEONE THAT HAS AN ACRE LOT, SEVEN FOOT IS NOT A BIG DEAL, BUT SOMEBODY LIKE THIS, I DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW TO ADDRESS IT IF WE LOOK AT BASED ON THE SIZE OF

[01:35:04]

IT'S GOING TO BE RIGHT IN THE CENTER OF HIS BACKYARD.

>> IF WE PUT A SHED ON THERE, IT'S GOING TO PUT YOU IN A 60 FOOT LOT KIND OF CATEGORY. THE LOT SIZE TO ME, I KNOW WE HAVE TO COME UP WITH A NUMBER AN THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

THE 40 IS TOO SMALL IN MY OPINION.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE RIGHT SIZE IS.

IF YOU WANT A SMALLER LOT DON'T CALL IT A SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCE. YOU ARE ON TOP OF EACH OTHER SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL BE IN A CONDO, IN MY OPINION.

AS FAR AS SOMETHING NICE, THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO BUILD HERE IN CHA COUNTY. I DON'T WANT JUST HUTCHES.

WE WANT LIVABLE COMMUNITIES AND UNLESS YOU HAVE SPACE AROUND YOU, YOU ARE IN AN APARTMENT ESSENTIALLY.

I HIKE SMALL POCKET PARKS. I'M AN OLD GUY.

I LIKE TO WALK AROUND THE BLOCK AND SEE SOME GREEN IF YOU CAN'T DO THAT IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD AND THERE'S A LOT OF COMMUNITIES I'VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH WHERE THEY HAVE A HOUSE SPOT.

SOME LOT THAT WASN'T BUILT UP AND HAVE A COUPLE OF PARK BENCHES IN THERE AND SOME NICE GARDENING.

THEY DON'T HAVE TO BE SOMETHING THAT THE COUNTY HAS TO MAINTAIN, BUT THAT'S SUPPOSEDLY THE REASON WE DON'T GO WITH THE PARK IT PARK AND I LIKE THAT CONCEPT. AS WE GET MORE DENSITY WE NEED MORE GREEN SPACE. THE ONLY GREEN SPACE WE SEEM TO WANT TO FUND AND I THINK IT'S NECESSARY ARE THE BIG MEGA PARKS FOR THE KIDS THAT PLAY BASEBALL. IT'S GREAT FOR THEM, BUT WHAT DO WE DO FOR THE ADULTS THAT WANT TO SEE GREEN SPACE?

NOT MUCH. >> ALSO JUST ONE MORE THOUGHT ON THE WIDTH OF THE LOT AND THE WAY THE NEIGHBORHOOD IS LAID OUT.

TYPICALLY WE SEE A 40 OR 50 OR 45 FOOT LOT AND THEY ALL HAVE THE SAME SET-BACK AND ARE LINED UP THE SAME.

A YEAR OR SO BACK I VISITED RIVER DOWN AND THEY HAVE 40 TO 70 FOOT LOTS AND THE WAY THAT HOUSES ARE POSITIONED AND IT VARIES DEPENDING ON THE LOT SIZE NEXT TO IT.

IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE SO THAT'S THE CHALLENGE THAT I HAVE TO OUR BUILDERS AND DEVELOPERS IS TO COME UP WITH WAYS TO USE THOSE LOTS AND MAKE OUR NEIGHBORHOODS LOOK A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN WHAT THEY ARE. I THINK THAT AS REASONABLE REQUEST AND I THINK A NUMBER OF THEM ARE SITTING HERE SO LET'S HEAR IF THEY CAN SOMEONE ANSWERS TO THOSE QUESTIONS AND THAT

CHALLENGE. >> OKAY.

>> ANYONE ELSE? >> MR. CHAIRMAN JUST ONE OTHER COMMENT FOR PUBLIC SAFETY AND THE CLOSER THE LOTS ARE AND THE HOMES ARE, A REQUIREMENT POSSIBLY THAT THE BOARD WOULD NEED TO CONSIDER BUILDING PERMITS AND THIS COULD BE SPR SPR SPRINKLER REGULATIONS. THAT HOME HAS TO BE SPRINKLERED BECAUSE IT'S NEXT TO THE NEIGHBOR SO THAT'S ANOTHER ASPECT WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT. THE BOARD I THINK ADDRESSED THE FIRE TRUCKS GETTING INTO THE NEIGHBORHOODS WITH THE WIDTH OF THE ROAD, SO THIS IS ANOTHER ASPECT.

>> USING FIREPROOF CONSTRUCTION FOR HOUSE OVER THREE STORIES, THAT'S ANOTHER ISSUE THAT I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE ADDRESSED ANYTHING LIKE THAT HERE IN THE COUNTY, BUT I MEAN IT USED TO BE THE REASON WE DIDN'T BUILD UP IS WE DIDN'T HAVE FIRE ENGINE TO GET IN THERE, BUT YOU GO TO A HIGH-RISE AND THEY SOLVE IT WITH THE BUILDING CODES AND CHANGE THAT SO THEY USE STEEL INSTEAD OF 2 BY 4S. IN MARYLAND MOST OF THE PRIVATE

[01:40:01]

THEY DON'T HAVE TO BE ELABORTE EITHER.

ANYONE ELSE? WE GOT THAT ONE DONE? OKAY. NARROW LOTS.

YOU HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF US THAT YOU NEED FOR THE NARROW

LOT ISSUE? >> I THINK WE HAVE A LOT TO WORK WITH AND WHAT WE MAY DO, AS FAR AS GETTING THIS TO DRAFT FORM FOR THE CODE WE MAY KICK THINGS BACK INDIVIDUALLY.

>> I HEARD DIFFERENT, KIND OF COMFORT LEVELS WITH THE PERC PERCENTAGES OF.

REALLY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE PUDS BECAUSE THE MASTER PLANS HAVE PERCENTAGES LIMITED SO IT REALLY WOULD JUST BE WHETHER OR NOT YOU WANT TO LIMIT OR NOT LIMIT WITHIN THE PUD AND WE'LL BRING YOU SOMETHING BACK AND YOU CAN TELL US WHEN TO GET TO THAT POINT IF YOU WANT TO ADD THE PERCENTAGE LIMIT.

>> I DIDN'T HEAR ANYBODY SAY ANYTHING OVER 20.

>> 20%? >> 40.

>> WHATEVER IT IS, IT NEEDS TO BE SPELLED OUT FOR THE BUILDERS.

THEY DON'T WANT A SITE PLAN THAT SAYS THIS AND THEN WE SAY NO.

THAT BECOMES HARD FOR THEM IN TERMS OF OPERATION AND EXPENSE SO MAYBE I WORK WITH THE 20%, BUT THERE HAS TO BE A TRADE-OFF IN TERMS OF HAVING THE ADDITIONAL PARKING AND MAYBE A POCKET PARK OR TWO OR AN AN AMENITY CENTER SO WE CAN UTILIZE IT FOR BOATING FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN THAT PARTICULAR AREA. THERE'S CERTAINLY AWAY TO GIVE UP SOMETHING TO GET SOMETHING AND I UNDERSTAND THAT.

>> ALRIGHT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YA'LL. >> OKAY.

NEXT WE'RE ON TO ITEM FIVE WHICH IS WATER CONSERVATION ISSUES AND

QUALITY. >> WE DO HAVE LANDSCAPE STANDARD AS TO. THAT'S KIND OF MOVED AROUND ON OUR AGENDA, BUT THAT'S COMING UP.

STEVE SO NEXT WE HAVE SOME STUFF ON WATER CONSERVATION AND QUALITY. WE HAVE A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT MOVING PARTS AND WE'LL ADDRESS THAT IN THE LANDSCAPING DISCUSSION IN A FEW MINUTES. BUT I HAVE STEVE UP HERE FOR THE WATER SENSE PORTION OF THAT. THAT WAS PART OF THE DISCUSSION FROM THE MARCH WORKSHOP AND YOU CAN ESSENTIALLY I WANT STEVE TO TALK ABOUT FLORIDA BUILDING CODE AND WHAT THAT ALLOWS.

I WILL TELL YOU OUR PARTNERS HAD A LOT OF COMMENTS ON THIS ONE.

STEVE WILL SAY THIS BETTER THAN I, BUT ESSENTIALLY THE FLORIDA BUILDING CODE THE THINGS IT MAKES SURE OF IS SAFETY AND COST EFFECTIVENESS, SO WITHIN THAT FLORIDA BUILDING CODE THEY KIND OF MANDATE THE WATER AND THAT STUFF, BUT I'LL LET STEVE TALK ABOUT THE WATER SENSE BECAUSE THAT WAS BROUGHT UP IN THE MARCH

WORKSHOP. >> OKAY.

THERE'S A HOLE SEPARATE VOLUME IN THE BUILDING CODE FOR ENERGY-CONSERVATION. A LOT OF IT IS ELECTRICAL, INSULATION AND THAT SORT OF THING.

IT GOES INTO WATER. THE AMOUNT USED.

THEY BROUGHT ME UP SO WE CAN PUT SOME PICTURES OF SOME TOILETS UP HE HERE.

>> FOR EXAMPLE THERE'S A LIMITATION ON 1 POINT 28 GALLONS PER FLUSH. THE $800 TOILET WILL DO THAT AMOUNT OF FLUSH. THE $237 AT THE BOTTOM IS A DUAL FLUSH TOILET SO YOU HAVE A NUMBER ONE AND A NUMBER TWO BUTTON FOR WHATEVER IS APPROPRIATE FOR YOUR ACTIVITY AND THE NUMBER ONE BUTTON IS A 1.28 GALLON FLUSH SO YOU HAVE SOME OPTIONS THERE SO THEY ARE SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT IN COST.

THE OTHER PART OF THESE, WHEN WE HAVE THESE WATER SENSE THEY ARE ALL THIRD PARTY CERTIFIED SO THE CONTRACTOR HAS TO BRING SOMEONE ELSE IN FOR A PLAN REVIEW, SOMEONE ELSE FOR INSPECTIONS TO

[01:45:02]

IT'S NOT SOMETHING I CAN SEND MY GUYS TO, AND GET THEM CERTIFIED TO DO THE INSPECTIONS. IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT THOUGH, WE ENCOURAGE THE ENERGY-CONSERVATION IT IS A STEWARD THING YOU WANT TO PROTECT YOUR RESOURCES.

TO MANDATE THIS IS A LITTLE IT OF A STRETCH MARLEY IN THESE TIMES WITH THE SUPPLY CHAIN ISSUES BECAUSE IT LIMITS YOUR AVAILABILITY OF FIXTURES YOU CAN USE AND YOU HAVE TO FIND SOMEONE ELSE TO COME IN AND DO INSPECTIONS AND CERTIFY THE BUILDING. SO YOU HAVE A HOME DONE, BUT THEY NEED THE THIRD PARTY TO SIGN OFF BEFORE WE CAN ISSUE A CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY IF THIS WAS MANDATED.

>> I THINK ONE OF THE OTHER COMMENTS IS THAT STAFF HAS HAD CONVERSATIONS. WE DO SEE FROM TIME-TO-TIME CERTAIN COMMUNITIES THAT GO HEAVY INTO THE WATER SENSE TYPE PROGRAMS AND THEREFORE, THAT'S ONE OF THEIR MARKETING TOOLS.

THEY WATER SENSE TYPE OF COMMUNITY.

BUILDERS CAN DO THAT, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY THE FLORIDA BUILDING CODE DOES A DECENT JOB OF LIMITING WATER USE AND USING ENERGY SAVING APPLIANCES AND THAT KIND OF STUFF SO ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ON THAT ONE?

THIS WAS A QUICK BRIEF ONE. >> COMMISSIONER?

>> IS WATER SENSE A TRADEMARK COPYWRITED TYPE CERTIFICATION

STANDARD? >> YES.

>> SO IT'S THIRD PARTY AND THEY DON'T TRAIN ANYBODY, BUT FOR

CERTIFICATION? >> CORRECT.

>> THERE WAS 17 PEOPLE AND AT THE MARCH MEETING I THINK THERE

WERE 17 CERTIFIED INSPECTORS. >> THE WATER STAR THAT WATER MANAGEMENT WAS TALKING ABOUT HAS 17 INSPECTORS FOR THE STATE OF FLORIDA LISTED ON THEIR SITE AND NO TELLING WHERE THEY ARE.

THE WATER SENSE IS AN EPA PROGRAM AND I COULDN'T TELL YOU WHO YOU ARE GOING TO GET TO DO IT.

I COULD NOT FIND AN INSPECTOR. >> TELL US ABOUT THE NEED FOR THE SECONDARY INSPECTION BEFORE YOU ISSUE THE CERTIFICATE?

>> THEY WOULD BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO COME IN AND VERIFY THAT EACH OF THOSE PRODUCTS REQUIRED IN THAT IS LABELED AS CERTIFIED, SO THE MANUFACTURER SENDS THEIR PRODUCT UP AND GETS IT CERTIFIED SO IT HAS A LABEL ON IT. THE PLAN REVIEWER GOES THROUGH AND LOOKS TO SEE THAT EACH ITEM ON THEIR LIST HAVE THE LABELED AND SPECIFIED PRODUCT AND THE INSPECTOR THEN GOES IN TO VERIFY EACH PRODUCT HAS BEEN INSTALLED, SO IT'S ENTIRELY OUTSIDE OF ANYTHING THAT WE WOULD HAVE ANY CONTROL OVER.

>> I'M JUST THINKING THAT MAYBE WE COULD HAVE TWO KINDS OF INSPECTIONS AND WE WOULD DO THE COUNTY INSPECTION FOR THE CERTIFICATE AND THEN DO THE SECONDARY INSPECTION TO LABEL IT

WATER SENSE CERTIFIED. >> IF WE WERE TO MANDATE THIS, WE'D PASS AN ORDINANCE SAYING THIS IS REQUIRED THEN WE WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ISSUE THE CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY UNTIL THIS WAS DONE. IF THE CONTRACTOR WANTS TO DO THIS ON THEIR OWN, THEN IT IS INDEPENDENT OF ANYTHING THAT WE

WOULD DO. >> I'M ALL ABOUT CONSERVATION.

MY DEGREE IS ENVIRONMENTAL SCIENCE AND I'M PASSIONATE ABOUT IT, BUT THE HOW SEVER, IF YOU DO THAT IN AN ORDINANCE HOW DO YOU ADDRESS REPLACEMENTS. WE'RE NOT GOING TO TELL HOME DEPOT THAT YOU CAN'T SELL THE 2.0 TOILET SO THE HOMEOWNER THAT WANTS TO REPLACE A TOILET WE'RE ADDING COSTS TO NEW HOMES BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO PASS IT ALONG.

I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU ADDRESS THAT AND I WOULD CERTAINLY LIKE US TO BE A SMART WATER, WHATEVER THE TERM IS ?

>> SUPERSTAR. >> I LIKED PRESENTATION THAT THE WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT GAVE US AND I'D LIKE SO SEE US MOVE

[01:50:04]

I DON'T KNOW THAT REQUIRING A CERTAIN TOILET IS GOING TO MAKE THAT DIFFERENCE FOR OUR NEW HOMES VERSES EXISTING HOMES.

>> WE'LL WORK WITH THEM AND SEE IF THERE'S WAYS TO GET IN THAT

DIRECTION. >> ANYONE ELSE SO YOUR RECOMMENDATION ON THIS ONE IS DON'T MAKE IT MANDATORY?

>> I WOULD NOT. >> HE'S FLUSHING THAT IDEA.

[LAUGHTER]>> I JUST WANT TO MAKE ONE THING PERFECTLY CLEAR.

WE GOT ONE DONE. >> I AGREE.

I THINK WE NEED TO MOVE IN THAT DIRECTION.

IT'S ESSENTIAL FOR OUR STATE AND ALSO, TO MANDATE $700 TOILETS DOESN'T MAKE IT THERE BECAUSE AS YOU KNOW IF THERE IS A REPLACEMENT DOWN THE LINE THE $800 TOILET WILL NOT BE WHAT SOMEBODY WILL BUY TO PUT IN THERE SO WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THE PULL 100% PICTURE AND FIGURE OUT HOW TO SAVE WHEREVER WE CAN.

>> OKAY. LANDS

LANDSCAPING. >> ALRIGHT. SO NEXT WE HAVE LANDSCAPE CODES. WE'VE DONE A LOT OF RESEARCH COMPARING WITH OTHER COUNTIES AND THAT KIND OF THING.

BETH IS OUR RESIDENT LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT BY TRADE SO I'M GOING TO LET HER TAKE THIS SECTION BECAUSE I ALWAYS SAY ZERO SCAPING AND IT'S NOT RIGHT SO I'D LET HER DO THIS ONE, AND IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS WE'LL ANSWER THOSE.

>> GOOD MORNING. OUR CURRENT CODE WE HAVE IN PLACE WAS ADOPTED IN 2003 AND AT THE TIME ZERO SCAPING WAS THE STANDARD AND THE PREMISE IS GROUPING MONTHS OF SIMILAR WATER USE SO YOU CAN EFFICIENTLY IRRIGATE.

SO THE CURRENT STANDARD NOW IS FLORIDA FRIENDLY ADOPTED BY STATUTE AND OUR CODE NEEDS UPDATE TOGETHER INCLUDE THOSE STANDARDS. RIGHT NOW THE CODE REQUIRES ONLY PLANTS WITH HIGH WATER NEEDS AND THEY'RE IDENTIFIED IN THE TABLE ORDINANCE. ONLY THOSE REQUIRE A WATER MITIGATION SYSTEM IF YOU ARE A LOW OR MEDIUM USE PLANT YOU CAN BE IRRIGATED BY HOSE BIB TO GET ESTABLISHED OR A SUPPLEMENTARY WHEN WE HAVE DRY SPELLS. WE ALSO DON'T REQUIRE ST.

AUGUSTINE BE IRRIGATED. IT DOES REQUIRE SUPPLEMENTAL, BUT IT'S NOT AUTOMATIC IRRIGATION.

OUR STANDARDS CURRENTLY ALSO REQUIRE SEPARATE ZONES FOR TURF AND SHRUB AREAS. THAT WAY YOU ARE NOT OVER WATERING AREAS THAT DON'T REQUIRE THAT HEAVY WATER USE.

THIS IS CONSISTENT WITH WHAT ST. JOHN'S WATER DISTRICT IS WANTING OUR STANDARDS TO BE SO THE PROPOSED CODE CHANGE IS THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO UPDATE STANDARDS TO ADD TO THE ZERO SCAPE STANDARD TO ADD TO THE FLORIDA FRIENDLY AND MORE CURRENT STANDARDS. THE NEXT AREA THAT WE'D LIKE TO UPDATE A LITTLE BIT IS A TREE MITI MITIGATION. THERE WAS AN AREA THAT PROVIDED FOR A TREE PROTECTION TRUST FUND.

NOT SURE HIGH OR HOW, BUT IN 2010 WHEN IT WAS RECODIFIED AND CHANGED FORMATS, THIS SECTION WAS LEFT OUT AND THIS GAVE US A BASIS TO CALCULATE IF THERE WAS A TREE REMOVED, A PENALTY IF YOU ARE REDEVELOPING A SITE THAT'S BEEN PRIOR DEVELOPMENT UNDER THE LANDSCAPE CODE AND TREES ARE NOW 25 INCH OAKS AND YOU NEED TO TAKE THOSE OAKS OUT, CURRENTLY WE DON'T HAVE MITIGATION FOR THOSE OAKS AND WE ASK YOU TO TRY TO PUT THEM BACK AS BEST YOU CAN, BUT WE DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO COLLECT FUNDS TO MITIGATE FOR THE FACT THAT THOSE TREES ARE NOT BEING PLANTED BACK. THAT'S THE NEXT THING WE'D LIKE TO ASK TO BRING BACK. THE STANDARD AT THAT TIME USED A

[01:55:03]

WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO IS WE LOOKED AT CITY OF JACKSONVILLE AND ST. JOHN'S. WE DON'T HAVE AN ACTUAL PERMIT FEE SO WE HAVE NO WAY TO DOUBLE IT WHICH IS WHAT BOTH OF THOSE OFFICES DO AND THAT WOULD BE THE ONE THING WE'D LIKE TO ADD.

CITY OF JACK SOBVILLE DOUBLED PERMIT FEE AND REQUIRES YOU TO REPLACE WITH TWICE THE AMOUNT OF TREES AND THAT THE MINIMUM BE A 4 INCH CALIBER TREE IF YOU ARE GOING TO DEVELOP A SITE.

IF YOU ARE NOT AND YOU'RE CLEARING IT FOR PREPPING IT FOR A SALE, THEY DOUBLE THE REQUIRED FEE.

THE LAST OPTION IS NOW IF YOU CLEAR THE ENTIRE SITE AND THERE ARE NO TREES LEFT TO SEE WHAT WAS THERE BEFORE, THEN THEY PUT THESE REALLY LARGE VINES ON THERE.

50,000 AN ACRE. ST. JOHN'S DOES SOMETHING SIMILAR. BOTH REQUIRES MITIGATEING FOR ALL TREE REMOVAL. OUR STANDARD IS NOT LIKE THAT.

OUR STANDARD DOES IT DIFFERENTLY.

WE HAVE AN END RESULT WHERE WE DON'T REQUIRE SURVEYS OF THE ENTIRE SITE AS THEY DO. THE SURVEY COST IS QUITE EXTENSIVE AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT GETS PASSED ON TO THE BUILDERS. SO THE CODE CHANGE WE'D LIKE TO PROPOSE IS WEIGHING A PERMITTING FEE AND LOOK AT APPROPRIATE PENALTIES. MAYBE NOT THE $50,000 PER ACRE, BUT AN INCH BASIS. SO AT THE MARCH WORKSHOP THERE WERE COMMENTS MADE THAT PERHAPS WE SHOULDBOROUGH THE ST. JOHN'S COUNTY ORDINANCE SO AFTER TWO YEARS OF STAKEHOLDERS MEETINGS IN ST. JOHN THEY DID NOT ADOPT T THE ORDINANCE BUT WE LOOKED AT THE ONE IN PLACE AND IT REQUIRED 50% NATIVES SO OUR CODE INCENTIVIZE NATIVE PLANTING AND WE GIVE INCREASED POINTS FOR NATIVES.

WE DON'T REQUIRE A MANDATORY NUMBER BE MONTHED, BUT WITH NATIVE TREE PLANTING OBVIOUSLY YOU ARE CONSERVING WATER AND YOU ARE NOT REQUIRING THE AUTOMATIC AIR DWAKS SYSTEM AND DEVELOPERS HAVE BEEN PLANTING MORE NATIVE TREES BASED ON THE VALUE OF THE

POINTS. >> HOW DO POINTS WORK?

>> WHAT DOES A POINT MEAN? >> FOR A TWO INCH NATIVE TREE YOU WOULD GET 2.2 POINTS. A TWO INCH NON-NATIVE LIKE A CREPE MYRTLE YOU WOULD ONLY GET TWO POINTS.

>> WHAT DO I DO WITH THE POINT? >> IF YOU ARE DOING RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISION WE REQUIRE 32 POINTS PER ACRE BASED ON THE TOTAL ACREAGE OF THE SITE. SO IF YOU ARE DOING A SUBSTANTIAL SITE YOU'RE 3,000 POINTS.

IF YOU CONSIDER A TREE IS TWO POINTS THAT'S A LOT OF TREES YOU ARE ULTIMATELY PLANTING. IF YOU CAN PLANT NATIVE AS 2.2 WILL GET YOU CLOSER TO WHATEVER YOUR POINTS ARE.

>> IF THEY DON'T REACH THE NUMBER OF POINTS OF THE DESIGN REVIEW WE TELL THEM THEY NEED MORE?

>> IF THEY DON'T REACH THE POINTS THEY DON'T GET THE PLAN

APPROVED. >> I'M JUST PROBING TO SEE WHAT

KIND OF TEETH ARE IN THIS THING. >> THEY GET MORE POINTS IF THEY PRESERVE. THE HIGHEST POINTS ARE FOR PRESERVING. THE NEXT IS IF YOU PLANT A NATIVE AND THE FINAL IS PLANTING A NON-NATIVE.

>> BUT UNDER OUR PRESENT ENVIRONMENT IT'S STILL OBVIOUSLY

[02:00:02]

BUILDING, CORRECT? >> NOT ACCORDING TO THAT CHART.

>> THIS IS REALLY THE ISSUE HERE I THINK.

>>, SO I CAN'T TELL YOU FROM THE CONSTRUCTION STANDPOINT WHAT THE COSTS ARE, BUT WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO PRESERVING ONE TREE ON ONE RESIDENTIAL LOT YOU HAVE TO HAVE A BUFFER OF ONE FEET FOR EVERY INCH CALIBER. SO IF YOU HAVE A 20 INCH OAK YOU HAVE TO BE 20 FEET FROM THAT TREE.

A 50 FOOT LOT WITH ALL OF THAT DOESN'T LEAVE A LOT OF ROOM FOR YOUR HOUSE. SO YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE GRADING IN THAT AREA. WE ALLOW A LITTLE INFRINGEMENT, BUT WHAT HAPPENS IS IF YOU HAVE CONSTRUCTION IMPACTS ONCE THAT DEVELOPER AND BUILDER IS GONE THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR REMOVING TREE THAT'S NOW DEAD BECAUSE IT'S HAD TWO OR THREE FEET ON IT BECOMES THE HOMEOWNERS RESPONSIBILITY AND I'VE RECEIVED HOMEOWNERS FROM PEOPLE THAT HAVE TO TAKE DOWN 50 FOOT PINE TREES FROM THEIR PROPERTY THAT ARE NOW DEAD BECAUSE THEY TRIED TO FILL, BUT THEY ARE SUSCEPTIBLE TO DAMAGE SO THIS HOMEOWNER WAS

FRUSTRATED. >> ON THAT CHART ARE THOSE OTHER SUBDIVISIONS THAT PRESERVED BECAUSE ONLY TWO DIDN'T PRESERVE

ANY TREES, RIGHT? >> LET ME EXPLAIN.

ST. JOHN'S AND DUVALL REQUIRE YOU TO SURVEY EVERYTHING WHEN YOU GO IN. WE HAVE A POINT STANDARD AND REQUIRE YOU TO MEET IT PRESERVING OR PLANTING.

YOU HAVE TO PLANT STREET TREES AND THEY KNOW THAT THEY HAVE TO PLANT THOSE TREES SO THEY KNOW THOSE POINTS WILL BE.

THE NEXT STEP IS THEY NEED OTHER POINTS AND THEY LOOK WHERE THEY CAN SAVE IN THE COMMON AREAS. LIKE ANNA BELL ISLAND.

THEY CHOSE TO MEET THEIR POINTS BY PLANTING AND THEY PROBABLY HAVE PRESERVED TREES, AS WELL SO THEY ONLY SURVEY WHAT THEY NEED TO MEET OUR POINT REQUIREMENTS, BUT THERE'S A LOT MORE BEING PRESERVED OUT THERE. SO ANNA BELL 100% PLANTING AS FAR AS CODE REQUIREMENT FOR US AND AGAIN, LET ME POINT OUT ALSO THAT THE CODE REQUIREMENT DOES NOT INCLUDE THE BUILDER BASIC PACKAGE THEY PUT ON EACH RESIDENTIAL LOT.

WE ARE LOOKING AT THE OVERALL DEVELOPMENT AND BUFFERS AND STREET TREES. SO ANNA BELL IS HAND THEY HAVE CHOSEN TO PLANT COMPLETELY TO MEET OUR CODE.

THEY MONTHED 1820 TREES. THEIR PERCENTAGE IS 98%.

IT'S SIMILAR FOR OTHER DEVELOPMENTS.

I DID A QUICK GRAB OF SOME. CROSS CREEK 2B IS 83 PERCENT AND

THAT'S SUBSTANTIAL. >> BUT BLACK CREEK VILLAGE.

>> PLAQUE CREEK VILLAGE THEY CHOSE TO PRESERVE.

THEY HAD SOME BEAUTIFUL OAKS OUT THERE SO THEY PRESERVED THEM AND THEY'RE GETTING CREDIT FOR TH THOSE. BUT THEY STILL HAD TO PLANT THEIR STREET TREES AND BUFFER TREE, SO THAT'S WHY YOU STILL SEE SOME TREE PLANTING. SO OUR STANDARDS, 32 POINTS PER ACRE AND THAT IS THROUGH THE COMMON AREA LANDSCAPING.

WE HAVE A BUFFER TO THE MAIN STREET.

THE STREET TREES AND THEN WE HAVE A SIMILAR USE BUFFER BETWEEN THAT SUBDIVISION OR THE NEXT OR OTHER RESIDENTIAL AND THIS IS MANAGED, WE REVIEW THE PLANS AND DO INSPECTIONS TO THE PLANS AND NOW IN APRIL OF 2019 WE RECOGNIZE THAT WE WERE NOT NECESSARILY ABLE TO INSPECT ALL OF THE STREET TREES THAT WERE GOING IN. THEY TEND TO BE ON YOUR RESIDENTIAL LOTS AND WE DID NOT HAVE STAFF TO MAKE SURE ALL THOSE TREES WENT IN SO WE STARTED TO REVIEW RESIDENTIAL

[02:05:01]

THIS IS A TWO MINUTE REVIEW PROCESS.

LOOK AND SEE IF IT IS A STREET TREE COMPARED TO THE OVERALL DEVELOPMENT PLAN AND WE THINK IT'S BEEN EFFECTIVE SO FAR, BUT AGAIN WE'RE NOT LOOKING AT THE BUILDER PACKAGE.

THEY'RE PUTTING IN A COUPLE OF TREES.

WE DON'T LOOK AT THAT. SO WITH OUR CURRENT SYSTEM WE MANAGE THAT WITH ONE PART TIME REVIEWER AND ONE PART TIME INSPECTOR AND I'M SHOWING YOU THE STAFFING COMPARISON TO JACKSONVILLE AND ST. JOHN'S COUNTY.

THEY HAVE SIGNIFICANT OTHER NUMBER OF REVIEWERS AND INSPE INSPECTORS.

SO AS FAR AS STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS WE WOULD RECOMMEND AGAIN THAT YOU ALLOW US TO MOVE FORWARD AND WITHOUT FLORIDA FRIENDLY IN THERE AND ADD THE MITIGATION BACK AND THE PENALTY SO WE CAN HOPEFULLY DISCOURAGE ANYMORE OF THIS CLEARING WITHOUT A PERMIT AND WE'D LIKE TO BRING ANY CHANGES YOU RECOMMEND BACK TO US AND YOU IN OCTOBER.

WE HAVE A LITTLE MORE TO TALK ABOUT BUT IF THERE'S ANYTHING HE HERE?

>> START DOWN HERE. ANY COMMENTS?

>> NO. THE PENALTIES ARE DEFINITE ON TH THERE.

>> PENALTIES ARE KEY FOR ME. >> COMMISSIONER?

>> JUST A COUPLE OF QUICK QUESTIONS.

WHAT'S THE ADVANTAGE OF USING THE LIVE OAK OVER THE DRAKE ELM?

>> DRAKE ELM IS A NON-NATIVE. WE NEED TO PICK ONE STANDARD AND GENERALLY LIVE OAK IS WHAT OTHERS USE.

>> MAKES SENSE. >> YOUR NATIVES MOST OF THE TIME ARE MORE WATER EFFICIENT, AS WELL.

>> SOMETIMES I READ AND IN FACT, I REALLY JUST READ AN ARTICLE AND THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT THE TREE CANDY AT THE ISLAND BEING A 27 PERCENT. DO WE KNOW WHAT THAT IS?

>> NO. >> JUST CURIOUS AS TO WHAT IT

MIGHT BE. >> WE DO HAVE A LOT OF FARM LAND SO YOU HAVE AREAS WITH JUST PASTURE AND BY CONTRAST WE HAVE A LOT OF TIMBER OUT THERE SO A LOT OF WHAT YOU SEE COMING DOWN ARE HOMEOWNERS TEMPERING THEIR PROPERTY.

>> I'M ALL FOR MOVING TO FLORIDA FRIENDLY PROVISIONS.

I THINK THAT'S WISE AND IT WILL HELP US WITH THE WATER CONSERVATION AND I WOULD HOPE THAT THE COST OF THAT OF THOSE PLANT MATERIALS WOULD BE LESS EXPENSIVE, BUT YOU NEVER KNOW ABOUT THAT. IN TERMS OF ANY KIND OF A PENALTY FOR OPERATING BEFORE THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO WE'VE HAD THAT HAPPEN A COUPLE OF TIMES THAT I KNOW OF AND COMMISSIONER BURKE'S AREA AND I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE THE PENALTIES THERE SO I WILL BE INTERESTED IN THE RECOMMENDATION ON THAT IF THEY'RE GOING TO CLEAR THAT'S FINE IF THEY HAVE PERMIT AND PERMISSION, BUT NOT BEFORE JUST BECAUSE THEY THINK THEY HAVE THE

OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT. >> YEAH I WAS GOING TO ASK, WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS CONCERNING THAT PENALTY?

ST. JOHNS? >> I THINK WE HAVE TO LOOK AT A RATIONAL NEXUS BETWEEN THE PENALTY AND WHAT OUR CODE IS.

IF OUR FINE IS AGAINST OPERATING WITHOUT A PLAN.

THAT'S DIFFERENT THAN TAKING TREES DOWN THAT YOU MITIGATE FOR SAINT JOHNS AND DUVALL SO WE NEED TO BE MORE FAIR ON THAT AND MAKE SURE YOU ARE NOT BEING OVER.

BUT WE DON'T WANT YOU TO GET AWAY WITH DOING WHAT YOU SHOULDN'T BE DOING SO WE HAVE TO HAVE A RATIONAL FAIR VALUE THERE THAT'S APPROPRIATE. I DON'T THINK 50,000 AN ACHELER BE ACRE WILL BE, BUT THEY ALSO FIND CONTRACTORS FOR OPERATING

[02:10:03]

WELCOME BACK WITH GOOD NUMBERS. >> I THINK I HEARD YOU CORRECT.

WE DON'T GET POINTS FOR ANY TREES THAT GO ON RESIDENTIAL LOTS? IS THAT WHAT YOU SAID?

>> IN THE PAST WE HAVE AND I WANT TO JUST GET AWAY FROM THAT BECAUSE WE'VE HAD FLORIDA STATUTE COME OUT THAT LET'S HOMEOWNERS TAKE TREES DOWN SO IF WE'RE REQUIRED TO MEET THE CODE AND THE HOMEOWNER DECIDES TO TAKE THAT OUT IT IS A LITTLE UNFAIR TO THEM BUT IF THEY WANT TO TAKE THAT OUT SOME PEOPLE DON'T WANT TREES ON THEIR LOTS AND SOME PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE SAFETY AND THE MAINTENANCE AND PERHAPS THEY CAN'T MAINTAIN A TREE. WE DON'T WANT TO MANDATE IT ON THEIR LOT IF WE HAVE IT IN A COMMON AREA OR A PRESERVED AREA.

>> THANK YOU. >> I THINK WE LIKE THE FIRST ONE. THAT MAKES SENSE.

MITIGATION LANGUAGE. THAT'S PROBABLY GOOD.

WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO INSPECT THESE PROPERTIES BEFORE THINGS START HAPPENING SO WE CAN SEE WHAT'S THERE.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S POSSIBLE. IF I'M A CONTRACTOR I'LL SAY BEFORE YOU SELL ME YOUR PROPERTY I WANT YOU TO CLEAR CUT THE TREES SO IT'S YOU THE OWNER AND NOT ME.

I DON'T KNOW HOW WE ADDRESS THAT.

I'VE SEEN PLACES WHERE THEY CHEER CUT A HOLE BUNCH OF STUFF AND IT'S THEIR RIGHT.WHOLE BUNCF AND IT'S THEIR RIGHT.

I DON'T KNOW HOW WE GET AT THAT KIND OF ISSUE.

THE IDEA OF PENALTIES I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE A PENALTY THAT MAKES SENSE BUT IT ALSO ENCOURAGES BETTER LANDSCAPING AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT LEVEL THAT IS.

THE REALLY SHOCK TREATMENT WITH THE $50,000 AN ACRE THING IS NOBODY WILL DO THAT, I'LL BET IF THAT'S IN PLACE AND THAT'S THE BEHAVIOR WE'RE LOOKING FOR SO I DON'T REALLY WANT TO COLLECT A LOT OF $50,000 AN ACRE PENALTIES, BUT I ALSO DON'T WANT TO IGNORE THIS AND THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW.

RIGHT SO I WOULD SAY WE DON'T WANT TO BE REAL PUNITIVE ABOUT IT BUT IF THEY DO, LET'S WHACK THEM.

THAT'S THE IDEA OF HAVING A PENALTY.

I THINK THAT ABOUT DOES IT IS. THERE ANYTHING ELSE TO FLUSH

OUT? >> NOT REALLY ON THIS.

>> I HAVE ONE MORE. I WILL ADD THAT THE HOLE BASIS FOR THE PENALTY IS TO KEEP THEM FROM DOING IT.

SO, TO BE FAIR I'M DRIVING IN ATLANTA AND THE GUY DOWN THE ROAD SAYING THEY'RE ON MY PROPERTY AND I'M LIKE, THERE'S NOTHING I CAN DO. I'M CALLING THE COUNTY MANAGER, BUT BY THE TIME THEY GOT THERE OF COURSE IT WAS DONE AND FOR THEM TO SAY WELL THEY'LL PAY THE PENALTY, THAT JUST CAN'T BE THE CASE. WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING.

FAIR TO ME IS NOT A WORD I THINK IS RIGHT WHENEVER IT COMES TO

THAT. >> RIGHT NOW OUR FIVE HUNDRED

DOLLAR FINE IS NOTHING. >> WOULD YOU SPEED THROUGH

WALDO? >> CAN I PLEAD THE FIFTH?

>> THAT'S ONE THAT WORKED. PEOPLE I GOT AND DIDN'T SPEED

THROUGH THERE. >> STILL DON'T.

>> EVEN I HAD THIS CONVERSATION WITH SENATOR BRADLEY BEFORE HE FIXED THAT PROBLEM AND THE ISSUE IS THAT'S WHAT A PENALTY IS SUPPOSED TO DO AND I DON'T WANT TO SEE DEVELOPERS GETTING PENALIZED SO LET'S MAKE IT CLEAR AND OBVIOUS AND EASY TO COMPLY, BUT IF THEY DON'T LET'S KICK THEM WHERE IT'S GONNA HURT.

[5.  Water Conservation / Quality]

>> GOT IT. ANYTHING ELSE ON THAT?

>> NEXT WE HAVE WATER QUALITY WHICH IS ALSO FROM OUR MARCH WORKSHOP. WATER CONSERVATION.

I APOLOGIZE. BUT WE'LL GO OVER THAT.

>> SO BACK IN MARCH'S WORKSHOP THERE WAS DISCUSSION ON

[02:15:03]

IT IS REQUIRED TO BE INSTALLED. AND IT IS A GOOD THING TO HAVE THAT AND MY UNDERSTAND IS THAT THE IRRIGATION BEGAN AS A WAY TO USE THE WATER THAT'S NOT, NOT HAVE TO CLEAN THE WATER FULLY AND DISCHARGE IT TO YOUR WATERWAYS AND IN THAT WORKSHOP AND WE'VE HEARD ELSEWHERE THAT CCUZ IS A LEADING AMOUNT OF RECLAIMED USE. SO GREAT THAT THEY HAVE A HIGH NUMBER OF CUSTOMERS IN THE LOW WATER USE RANGE BECAUSE THEY ARE USING RECLAIMED IRRIGATION. WITH GROWTH COMES SOME INCREASED NEED FOR THIS WASTEWATER AND DEMAND FOR THE RECLAIMED IRRIGATION AS WE BUILD OUT THE MASTER PLAN AREAS, WE WILL HAVE LOTS OF HOMES ADDING TO THE SYSTEM AND THAT WILL INCREASE THE DEMAND FOR THIS WE CLAIMED WATER AND RIGHT NOW WE HAVE HEARD FROM CCUZ THAT THERE'S TIMES IN THE YEAR THAT WE HAVE DEMAND EXCEEDING CAPACITY. USUALLY IN THE LATE SPRING.

BACK IN 2010 CLAY COUNTY ADOPTED THE IRRIGATION ORDINANCE WE CURRENTLY HAVE AND THIS WAS EXACTLY MIRRORING THE ST. JOHN'S WATER MANAGEMENT STANDARDS. THERE'S EXCEPTIONS IF YOU USE I'M BLANKING. IF YOU USE MISTERS AND THAT TYPE YOU ARE EXEMPT IF YOU USE RECLAIMED IRRIGATION YOU ARE EXEMPT FROM THE STANDARDS AND THOSE HAVE WATERING DAYS LIMITATIONS. RECLAIMED IS NOT SUBJECT TO THAT SO WHAT YOU HAVE IS THE PERCEPTION IF THERE'S NO RESTRICTION THERE MUST BE LOTS OF WATER TO BE USED SO WE CLAIMED IS USED OFTEN AND MY NEIGHBORS USE IT DAILY.

THE PERCEPTION YOU CAN WATER WITH IT, WITH NO RESTRICTIONS AND THAT DOESN'T HELP WITH SHORTAGE IN CAPACITY.

ONE THING THAT WAS TALKED A LOT ABOUT IS THERE NEEDS TO BE EDUCATION OF HOMEOWNERS AND WE NEED TO LET THEM KNOW THAT THIS IS A LIMITED SUPPLY AND WORK WITH THEM AND HELP THEM WITH THEIR TIMERS. I HEARD A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT. THE OTHER THING IS ENFORCEMENT THAT WAS BROUGHT UP AND THIS ORDINANCE REQUIRES, SAYS LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS HAVE JURISDICTION GOVERNED BY THIS ORDINANCE. LAW ENFORCEMENT, POLICE.

THEN IT GOES FURTHER TO SAY THE COUNTY MANAGER MAY DELEGATE ENFORCEMENT TO AGENCIS AND DEPARTMENTS OF COUNTY GOVERNMENT. JUST LEAVE THAT THOUGHT WITH YOU FOR A SECOND. THIS IS REALLY NOT UNDER OUR PER VIEW PER SE, OTHER CITIES AND COUNTIES ACTUALLY OWN THEIR OWN UTILITY COMPANY. WE'RE A SEPARATE FROM THE UTILITY AUTHORITY SO WHILE WE SUPPORT THEIR EFFORTS AND WE REALLY DON'T HAVE THE ENFORCEMENT CAPABILITY.

WE DON'T HAVE STAFF RIGHT NOW, BUT WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO TALK FURTHER ABOUT HOW TO HELP ON THAT SO I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU A COUPLE OF STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS TO ADDRESS THE EDUCATION COMPONENT. THAT WE CREATE A COUNTY WEB PAGE SIMILAR TO WHAT ST. JOHN'S COUNTY HAS DONE WITH INFORMATION ABOUT WATER WISE, WATER SENSE, IRRIGATION AND FLORIDA FRIENDLY IRRIGATION. WITH LINKS TO HELP THEM GET TO A WEBSITE FOR INFORMATION. WHATEVER WE CAN DO TO HELP THEM LEARN BETTER WAYS TO CONSERVE WATER.

WE WOULD HIKE TO CONTINUE WORKING WITH CCUA TO LOOK AT AN AMENDMENT IF THEY WOULD CONSIDER A RESTRICTION FOR RECLAIMED IRRIGATION USE. ST. JOHN'S COUNTY LIMITS THEIR

[02:20:03]

IT WOULD HELP WITH ENFORCEMENT SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO FIGURE OUT IF THIS IS A RECLAIMED NEIGHBORHOOD OR POTENTIAL IRRIGATION NEIGHBORHOOD. IF YOU LOOK AT THE ADDRESS AND THE IRRIGATION YOU KNOW EASILY IF IT IS A VIOLATION.

THAT GOES TO THE LAST ITEM. CONSIDER PARTNERSHIP WITH CCUA FOR ENFORCEMENT OF IRRIGATION. AND WE'RE OPEN TO CONTINUE.

STAFF IS OPEN TO WORK WITH CCUA FURTHER TO SEE WHAT WE CAN DO TO

HELP. >> I WOULD ADD TO THAT.

WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH JEREMY SOME AND PAUL.

WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH THOSE GUYS AND THEY ARE WORKING ON STUFF FROM THEIR END. BETWEEN THEY'RE GROUP AND OUR GROUP WE KNOW THIS ONE IS A SLOW MOVER SO ONE THING WE WOULD SAY IS WE WILL CONTINUE TO WORK WITH THEM.

WE'VE HAD A MEETING RECENTLY AND WILL PROBABLY HAVE ANOTHER ONE IN THE NEXT WEEK OR TWO TO KEEP CHURNING ON TO THIS ONE TO GET TO COMMON GROUND TO PUT IN THE CODE.

>> YOU'RE RIGHT. ORANGE PARK HAS IT'S OWN WATER UTILITY. AND REUSE, AS WELL.

SO IN ORANGE PARK WE HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO ENFORCE WITHIN ONE LOCAL GOVERNMENT. THIS OUGHT TO BE A PRECURSOR TO USE ENFORCEMENT WITH CCUA. AND ALSO LOOK INTO POTENTIAL WATER, AS WELL AS SEWER ENFORCEMENT, AS WELL.

CCUA IS PUTTING IN WATER AND SEWER AT THE LAKE AND NOBODY EVEN HAS TO LOOK UP TO IT AND IT'S KIND OF CRAZY AND THEY DON'T HAVE THE POWER OR ENFORCEMENT SO I DON'T KNOW HOW WE CAN CRAFT AN AGREEMENT WITH CCUA TO HELP THEM.

THE ONLY ENFORCEMENT FOR SEWER LOOK UP IS WHEN YOUR SEPTIC FAILS. THEY HAVE TO GET A DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH CERTIFICATE TO PUT ASEPTIC TANK IN AND WE CAN SAY NO, BUT THAT COULD BE 15 TO 20 YEARS FROM NOW.

THIS WOULD BE A GOOD PRECURSOR TO COLLABORATE WITH CCUA ON THE IRRIGATION WATER. HOW DO WE CRAFT A PARTNERSHIP

THERE? >> I AGREE WITH THE COMMISSIONER. OBVIOUSLY WE HAVE TO WORK WITH CCUA ON THAT AND WITH ANY ORDINANCE YOU HAVE TO HAVE TEETH OTHERWISE, IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN AND I THINK THERE'S AN EDUCATIONAL COMPONENT THAT NEEDS TO GO ON IS THOSE THAT HAVE REUSABLE WATER, IT'S USE IT AS MUCH AS YOU NEED TO AND MAYBE THE EXTENSION OFFICE CAN OFFER SOME BACKYARD CLASSES ON HOW TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR LAWN AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE A MORE SO ACTIVE THING THAN A PASSIVE WAY TO TRY TO GET THE WORD OUT TO PEOPLE AND THEN WITH CCUA. THEY SEND PILLS OUT EVERY MONTH SO THEY CAN CERTAIN I WILL LET PEOPLE KNOW THERE'S A PROBLEM.

MAYBE THEY NEED TO, I GUESS THEY DON'T HAVE A WAY TO MONITOR WATER HIKE AN INDIVIDUAL HOUSEHOLD, BUT MAYBE THAT'S MOVING FORWARD THAT'S WHAT THEY NEED TO DO TO KEEP TRACK, AND IF YOU GO OVER YOU ARE PAYING MORE FOR THE IRRIGATION WATER.

THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN'T DO ON OUR OWN.

IN TERMS OF IRRIGATION ENFORCEMENT DOES ANYBODY THINK WE NEED TO CLARIFY LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO GO AFTER SOMEONE WITH THEIR SPRINKLERS.

>> OR THE COUNTY MANAGER DRIVING FROM HOUSE TO HOUSE PASSING OUT WITH A RANTS FOR SOMEBODY USING TOO MUCH IRRIGATION WATER.

I JUST THINK MAYBE WE SHOULD LOOK AT THAT A BIT.

>> I MEAN HERE IN FLORIDA WE'RE LAUGHING ABOUT THAT COMMENT, BUT IN CALIFORNIA THAT'S THE REALITY.

>> EVERYTHING WEST IS THAT WAY. >> NOT ENOUGH WATER TO DRINK.

I'M KIND OF ANTI-WATER POLICE. I DON'T HAVE RECLAIMED WATER IN

[02:25:05]

CCUA, I DID A LOT OF RESEARCH ON THIS, IT WAS A BIG ISSUE IN MY NEIGHBORHOODS BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE RECLAIMED WATER AND DURING THE SUMMER MONTHS I PAY MORE FOR WATER THAN MYE ADDED TAXES.

PART OF THAT IS WHEN YOU USE POTABLE WATER TO IRRIGATE WITH THAT'S ONLY ONE THIRD OF THE COST.

THE REAL COST IS IN THE SEWER THAT YOU GET CHARGED FOR THAT YOU DON'T USE AS PART OF THAT BILL SO CCUA I THINK HAS THE ABILITY TO CHANGE THEIR RATES AND THEY DO HAVE A PROGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE RIGHT NOW, SO AFTER YOU GET OVER THE TIER ONE THRESHOLD THAT THING STARTS TO TAKE OFF AND THAT'S THE INCENTIVE NOT TO USE TOO MUCH WATER.

IF THEY DON'T HAVE A CHARGE RATE SYSTEM FOR THE RECLAIMED CERTAINLY THAT WOULD BE THE FIRST THING THEY NEED TO ADDRESS. AS FAR AS COUNTY ENFORCING IT, THERE'S WATER DAYS I KNOW AND I DON'T THINK ANYBOD LOOKS AT THAT TOO HARD. MOST PEOPLE TRY TO CONFORM TO THAT. I DO.

I'M PROBABLY CONSIDERED AN ABUSER.

FORTUNATELY. >> COUNTY MANAGER?

>> DOES THE MINUTES CLARIFY WATER ABUSEER?

>> I HAVE ENOUGH RESOURCES WHERE I HIKE TO HAVE A NICE LANDSCAPE AROUND MY HOUSE. SO I PAY FOR IT.

THAT'S ONE CONSIDERATION OTHER THAN THE WATER POLICE.

>> CAN WE GET KENNEDY TO PUT IT ON THE CLAY COUNTY AS CALENDAR.

>> WE LISTED ST. AUGUSTINE GRASS IS A LOW WATER GRASS?

>> IT DOES NOT REQUIRE A LOT. I BELIEVE IT'S IN MEDIUM.

>> I HAVE ST. AUGUSTINE IN THE FRONT AND THE BACKYARD IS NO

MAINTENANCE AT ALL. >> ST. AUGUSTINE IS VERY FUSSY.

>> CAN BE. >> OKAY.

HAVE WE BEAT THIS ONE DONE? IS THERE ANYTHING YOU NEED DIRECTION ON THAT WE HAVEN'T TALKED ABOUT?

>> NO WE'LL CONTINUE THOSE COMMUNICATIONS WITH CCUA.

>> NEXT WE HAVE A FEW WATER QUALITY SLIDES AS WE'RE GETTING INTO THE NINTH INNING HERE. DODDIE WILL COME UP AND TALK TO US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT. MOST OF THAT HONESTLY NOT TO STEAL HER THUNDER, BUT IT'S A LOT OF DISCUSSIONS WITH CCUA, AS

WELL. >> WHEN WE LEFT THE WORKSHOP THERE WERE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR CCUA THAT WE TAKE A LOOK AT A CONNECTION AT 500 AND 250 FEET AND YOU ASKED FOR A MAP ABOUT WHERE SEPTIC IS ALLOWED SO WE'LL PROVIDE THAT FOR YOU AS PART OF THIS. ON THE LEFT THIS IS THE HOLE COUNTY AND THE RIGHT IS THE EMPLOYEE UP OF THAT.

THE RED OUTLINE IS THE URBAN SERVICE AREA AND YOU CAN SEE THE PURPLE LINES ARE GRAVITY FED SEWER SYSTEMS AND THE GREEN LINES ARE FORCE MAIN AND THEN IT'S HARD TO TELL, BUT THERE'S A BLUE LINE AROUND THE LAKES AREA WHERE THEY HAVE WATER, BUT NOT

SEWER SYSTEMS. >> SO WHERE WE ALLOW SEPTIC NOW.

THESE ARE ZONING DISTRICTS AND ON THE LEFT IT'S OUTSIDE THE SERVICE AREA AND THEN THE TWO MASTER PLANS.

A NUMBER OF THOSE ZONING DISTRICT DESIGNATIONS ARE FAIRLY HIGH DENSITY, HOWEVER SEPTIC IS ALLOWED ONLY IF YOUR DENSITY FOR THAT PARTICULAR PROJECT IS BETWEEN TWO TO THREE UNITS

[02:30:01]

EXCUSE ME. SO THE ROUND AREA UP AT THE TOP IS A HIGH DENSITY AREA IN THE ORANGE PARK AREA.

THERE'S A LOT OF SEWER LINES THERE.

THE PURPLE KIND OF SHOWS UP THERE.

IT'S NOT SEPTIC THROUGHOUT THAT AREA UNLESS YOU ARE VERY LOW DENSITY.

THE CONVERSE IS TRUE WHERE YOU SEE NO SERVICE LINES AT ALL.

WE THE PRETTY MUCH ASSUME THAT'S ALL ON SEPTIC.

SO FROM THE WORKSHOP THERE WAS THE SUGGESTION BY THE BOARD THAT WE CREATE A CONNECTION REQUIREMENT TO APPLY TO ALL THE RESIDENTIAL, INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENTS THAT WOULD IT TO BE A CONNECTION IF YOU WERE WITHIN 500 FEET OF THE SEWER LINE AND THERE'S AN EXCEPTION OF RESIDENTIAL OF THREE HOMES OR LESS, RIGHT? CURRENTLY WE HAVE ESSENTIALLY THAT. WE HAVE A REQUIREMENT THAT APPLIES TO RESIDENTIAL, COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL AND PROVIDES THAT SAME EXEMPTION, BUT WHERE WE DIFFER IS RIGHT NOW OUR CODE REQUIRES A CONNECTION IF SERVICE IS AVAILABLE AND THAT'S BASED ON FLORIDA STATUTE. THE LANGUAGE IS REPRESENTED IN THE COMPREHENSIVE MAN AND IT'S BASED ON THE SEWAGE FLOW RATE.

IF YOU ARE LESS THAN A THOUSAND GALLONS YOU HAVE TO CONNECT.

IF YOU ARE USING A SYSTEM MORE AT OVER A THOUSAND GALLONS A DAY YOU HAVE TO CONNECT WITHIN 50 FEET AND THE LARGER DEVELOPMENTS

WITHIN THE QUARTER MILE. >> WHAT DOES THAT MEAN IN TERMS OF NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN THE HOUSE? I DON'T KNOW. I'M NOT QUALIFIED.

>> WHAT IS A THOUSAND GALLONS? >> HOW MANY PEOPLE?

I DON'T KNOW. >> ABOUT 100 GALLONS PER DAY.

>> SO A THREE BEDROOM HOUSE IS 300 GALLONS PER DAY SO THAT

EXEMPTS MOST FACILITIES, RIGHT? >> THAT'S THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH JUSTIFIES THE SIZE OF THE SEPTIC WHEN THEY LOOK AT SEPTIC

IS THE NUMBER OF BEDROOMS. >> SO YOU NEED HOW MANY BEDROOM

IS A THOUSAND GALLONS? >> TEN.

>> A LOT. >> THAT EXEMPTS ALL RESIDENTIAL

CONSTRUCTION JUST ABOUT. >> WELL, NO, NOT LIKE APARTMENTS

OR ANYTHING. >> WE DON'T HAVE MANY OF THOSE,

BUT WE HAVE MASSIVE ROOFTOPS. >> THERE'S MORE COMING.

>> IT DOESN'T EXEMPT, BUT IT'S THE THRESHOLD OF WHERE YOUR DISTANCE SHOVEL AND NOT WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE TO CONNECT.

>> PROPERTY LINE, RIGHT? >> RIGHT.

>> CLOSE TO THE PROPERTY LINE IS PRETTY TOUGH, RIGHT?

>> THE WAY IT HAPPENS IS THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH WHICH IS HOUSED ON THE THIRD FLOOR FOR ONE-STOP SHOP CONVENIENCE THEY WORK WITH CCUA AND THEY HAVE TO GET LETTERS OF AVAILABILITY OR NON-AVAILABILITY BEFORE THEY DO THE SEPTIC PERMIT, SO THERE'S A LOT OF COMMUNICATION INVOLVED. IF IT'S AVAILABLE THEY HAVE TO

CONNECT BASICALLY TO THE SYSTEM. >> IS THAT THE FRONT OF THEIR PROPERTY LINE? I'M THINKING OF IN KEYSTONE HEIGHTS WHERE TRACE AVENUE DEA

[02:35:01]

PROPERTY THAT HAS CCU CA? >> YES THE WAY I READ IT C.

A? >> YES THE WAY I READ IT.A?

>> YES THE WAY I READ IT. >> BUT THE NEXT STREET OVER IS

NOT. >> BUT THEN YOU COULD GET A

DOMINO AFFECT. >> CONNECTED WHAT THOUGH? TO THE MAIN? I MMEAN, IT IS A PRETTY LOOSE T TERM.

THERE'S NO REAL TEETH TO THIS THING.

TO GET A BUTTED TO A SEWER MAIN IF ONE WAS RUNNING DOWN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET THE FIRST ROW OF HOUSES WOULD BE THERE, BUT ANYONE AROUND IN THE HOLE SUBDIVISION WOULD BE EXEMPT FROM

THE WAY THAT READS. >> IF IT IS A SUBDIVISION AND YOU'RE PLANNING THAT YOU HAVE MORE THAN 50 HOUSES THEN THE WHOLE THING HAS TO BE CONNECTED SEWER.

>> THE EXAMPLE OF THE ABUTTING PROPERTY LINE, I HAVE A STORY A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO SOMEBODY BROUGHT A PROPERTY ON TRAIL RIDGE. THEY NEEDED TO REPLACE THEIR SEPTIC TANK AND THEY DIDN'T WANT TO CONNECT TO CCUA, BUT CCUA WAS ESSENTIALLY IN FRONT OF THEIR HOUSE AND THEY WERE FIGHTING AND SENDING E-MAILS TO ME AND I'M LIKE LOOK, THE STATUTE SAYS THIS. IT WAS OUT IN FRONT OF THEIR HOUSE AND THEY HAD TO CONNECT. THEY DIDN'T WANT TO BECAUSE OF THE COST. IT WAS A PRETTY BIG PIECE OF PROPERTY AND THEIR HOUSE WAS LIKE AT THE BACK OF THE LOT AND THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY TO GET IT ALL THE WAY UP THE DRIVEWAY SO IT WAS AT A VERY HIGH COST FOR THE HOMEOWNER, BUT

THEY HAD TO. >>, BUT IT WAS ANOINT TEN

BEDROOM HOUSE, RIGHT? >> NO.

IT WAS NOT. >> WOULDN'T THAT EXEMPT THEM?

>> THEIR SEPTIC SYSTEM JUST NEEDED TO BE REPLACED.

>> THEY WERE UNDER A THOUSAND GALLON A DAY DISCHARGE A DAY?

>> BUT IT ABUTS THEIR PROPERTY SO THEY STILL HAVE TO DO IT.

>> I'M TRYING TO EXPLORE THIS BECAUSE WE'RE LOOKING AT GOING TO SOME KIND OF REQUIREMENT WITHIN A CERTAIN DISTANCE AND I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHERE WE ARE TODAY.

>> THAT'S THE CONVERSATIONS I HAD WITH JEREMY JOHNSON AND HE SAID THEY'RE DOING CALCULATIONS AND LOOKING AT DIFFERENT THINGS AND SAID HE WOULD HAVE THAT INFORMATION TO US AND WE'D MEET AND SEE WHAT WE CAN COME TOGETHER WITH PUTTING IN CODE.

I TALKED TO HIM SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THAT.

>> THAT'S ESSENTIALLY WHAT THAT SLIDE SAYS IS THAT WE NEED SOME FEE FEEDBACK.

THEY WANTED TO TAKE A LOOK AND GET BACK WITH US.

WE'D GET BACK TO YOU LATER ON WHICH CATEGORY THAT 500 FEET WILL APPLY TO AND YOU KNOW, GO FROM THERE.

>> WHAT IS THE RELEVANCE OF TH

THAT? >> WELL, SO IN TRYING TO ADDRESS THIS WE LOOKED AT THE PLAN AND THE POLICIES INVOLVED IN DISTANCE AND REQUIREMENTS FOR QUESTIONS AND IDENTIFIED POLICIES THAT WE WOULD BRING BACK TO YOU TO TWEAK PROBABLY.

THEN OF COURSE WE HAVE THAT FIRST ASK OF THESE THREE CATEGORIES AND THREE DIFFERENT DISTANCE REQUIREMENTS AND WHICH ONE GOES TO FIVE HUNDRED. SO FOR THAT, TO ANSWER THAT ONE, I KNOW WHERE IN THE CODE RIGHT NOW THAT WE WOULD MAKE THAT CHANGE, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT CHANGE IS GOING TO BE UNTIL WE TALK WITH CCUA AND THEY GIVE US FEEDBACK TO BRING BACK TO YOU AS TO WHAT THEY'RE RECOMMENDATION IS.

>> SO THE CONCERN IS HIGH ARE WE WAITING ON CCUA? WHAT RELEVANCE DOES THAT HAVE DO WITH THIS?

>> THEY ARE LOOKING AT THE DISTANCES THAT ARE OUT THERE NOW AND THE RATES THAT WHICH THEY'RE HAVING PEOPLE NEEDING TO

[02:40:01]

CONNECT. >> IT IS A CAPACITY CONSTRAINT

AT CCUA? >> I THINK IT IS CAPITOL COST, CHAIRMAN LIKE THEY HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AS THEY EXPAND THEIR SERVICE AREA THEY HAVE TO GET BONDS AND CAPITOL AND THIS CAPITOL COST IS SOMETHING THEY HAVE TO LOOK AT.

>> BUT THIS WOULD GO TO THE ISSUE OF HAVING THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN PLACE BEFORE WE OKAY ZONING?

>> YES. >> ISN'T THAT WHAT WE'RE DOING?

>> WE ARE. IT'S AN ON-GOING CONVERSATION

THAT WE NEED TO BRING BACK. >> SO WE'RE GOING TO SIZE THIS SO WE CAN KEEP ZONING, RIGHT? IS THAT THE IDEA?

>> YES. I WOULD SAY IN YOUR URBAN SERVICE AREA THOSE ZONINGS ARE LINING UP PRETTY GOOD WITH WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO WITH THE LOOK UP SYSTEM.

>> SOME OTHER AREAS DEVELOPED RIGHT NOW WITHOUT ANY UTILITY INFRASTRUCTURE IF WE DID SOMETHING HIKE THIS, IT WOULD STOP THAT DEVELOPMENT, IS THAT TRUE?

>> SO HAVING TALKED TO JEREMY AND HE COULD NOT BE HERE AND WHOSE THE REPRESENTATIVE THAT'S HERE? THERE WE GO. YOU GUYS CAN WEIGH IN AS YOU LIKE. SO TALKING TO JEREMY WHAT ENDS UP HAPPENING WITH CCUA AND THE NEW DEVELOPMENTS IS THERE'S AN AGREEMENT THAT GOES OUT AND EVERY DEVELOPMENT COMES THAT TAKES A BIT FROM THE CONSUMPTIVE ABUSE PERMIT SO WHEN THEY GO IN THEY ARE PROMISING THAT SERVICE WILL BE THERE AND THE LIMITING FACTOR IS THE CONSUMPTIVE USE PERMIT.

SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT THIS WHAT COMES FIRST THE CHICKEN OR THE EGG? THE CONTRACT CAME FIRST.

>> THANK YOU, HOWARD. PAUL STEIN WITH CCUA.

THE OTHER PART I THINK WE'RE LOOKING AT AND WE HAVE NOT COMPLETED THE ANALYSIS ON, WE WERE WANTING TO LOOK AT WHAT'S THE COST TO THE HOMEOWNERS AS WE GET ONE HOUSE, TWO HOUSE, FIVE HOUSES BACK DOWN A STREET. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT TO SEE THE RELATIVE CASINO TO HOMEOWNER, SO WE COULD TRANSPARENTLY BRING THAT TO YOU AND TOGETHER UNDERSTAND HEY, IF WE IMPOSE A $250 OR 500 FOOT LOOK UP WHAT'S THAT REALLY IMPLY TO THE HOMEOWNERS THAT ARE BACK THERE FROM A POLICY STANDPOINT? LOOK UP WHAT'S THAT REALLY IMPLY TO THE HOMEOWNERS THAT ARE BACK THERE FROM A POLICY STANDPOINT?K UP WHAT'S THAT REALLY IMPLY TO THE HOMEOWNERS THAT ARE BACK THERE FROM A POLICY STANDPOINT? WHEN IT GETS EXTENDED DOWN A STREET THAT STREET ENDS UP PAYING FOR THAT ESSENTIALLY. THEY PAY FROM THEIR HOUSE IN SO THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT AND WE WERE GOING TO BRING THOSE COLLECTIVE COSTS BACK FOR YOUR UNDERSTANDING.

>> BUT THE UTILITY, CCUA IS FINANCING THAT FOR THE HOMEOWNER

AT SOME LEVEL, RIGHT? >> IN MANY CASES, YES.

>> DOES CCUA HAVE THE CAPACITY? IS THAT ONE OF THE ISSUES TO

TREAT WASTEWATER? >> I DON'T THINK THAT'S AN ISSUE AT ALL. IT REALLY WAS FROM THE HOMEOWNER AN AFFORDABILITY ISSUE AND ALL OF US COMING IN WITH OPEN EYES.

THE FURTHER WE GET FROM IF THIS STREET HAS, IF THIS STREET RIGHT HERE HAS A SEWER LINE ON IT AND COMING TOWARDS YOU THERE'S FIVE HOUSES, WELL THE HOUSE ON THE STREET RIGHT HERE ABUTTING THIS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT. TWO OR THREE HOUSES IN THEY DON'T DO THAT RIGHT NOW. SO THE DISCUSSION IS WOULD WE REQUIRE THEM TO CONNECT? LET ME GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

IF WE PUT A 500 FOOT ORDINANCE IN PLACE WHICH WE THINK WE'RE INTERESTED IN WE JUST NEED TO LOOK AT IT AND SAY BEFORE WE ADOPT IT WHAT'S IT GOING TO COST PEOPLE.

THAT'S WHAT MY INTEREST IS TAKING TIME LOOKING AT IT.

SO, ON THIS SIDE THERE'S A HOUSE THAT ABUTS AND WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT AND THEY'RE REQUIRED TO CONNECT NOW WHEN THEIR SEPTIC SYSTEM FAILS. LET'S GO THE OTHER WAY.

LET'S SAY THERE'S A HOUSE FOUR HOUSES IN DOWN HERE AND THEY WANT TO CONNECT. THAT'S KIND OF WHAT WE'RE GETTING AT IF THEY WANTED TO CONNECT WHAT WE WOULD NORMALLY

[02:45:04]

THE THREE OTHER HOUSES NOW A ABUTTING UP TO IT NOW.

IF WE DID THIS IT WOULD REQUIRE THAT HOUSE FOUR HOUSES THAT WAY TO CONNECT IF I'VE GOT THE MAIN RIGHT HERE.

DID THAT BRING SOME CLARITY SO WHY WE WANT TO LOOK AT IT AND BRING, HEY, THIS IS THE COST IMPLICATION?

>> AND IT'S NOT A SMALL COST. >> I KNOW THAT TO REPLACE ASEPTIC TANK IS RIGHT NOW ABOUT $25,000.

>> COMMISSIONER WHAT I'M GOING TO SAY TO THAT IS WHEN THE SEPTIC TANKS FAIL, I'M NOT THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT, BUT WHEN THEY FAIL IF SEWER IS AVAILABLE THEY HAVE TO CONNECT.

>> IF THEIR SEPTIC TANK HAS FAILED, THAT'S ABOUT $5,000 TO RE REPLACE RIGHT NOW.

THE HOLE SYSTEM, SO IF IT'S THAT COST AND THEN IT'S PROBABLY ABOUT THAT TO CONNECT.WHOLE SYS THAT COST AND THEN IT'S PROBABLY ABOUT THAT TO CONNECT. WE'D WANT TO BRING THAT COST INFORMATION BACK AT A LATER DAY. WE BELIEVE THE SEWER IS MORE COST EFFECTIVE FOR THE HOMEOWNER OVERTIME.

>> I WOULD THINK THAT'S PROBABLY THE CASE, BUT TO THEN PUT A $20,000ISH CHARGE ON THOSE THREE HOUSES IN BETWEEN.

>> IT IMPLIES AS SOON AS THEIRS GOES OUT.

>> WHERE THE CODE STANDS TODAY THEY DON'T HAVE TO CONNECT UNTIL THEIRS FAILS BUT IF WE CHANGE THEED OR THEY WOULD BE REQUIRED TO TAKE ON THE ADDED EXPENSE IMMEDIATELY.

>> YES, COMMISSIONER. >> MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE'RE ONLY DOING THIS IF THE SEPTIC TANK FAILS.

>> THAT'S WHERE WE ALREADY ARE. >> BUT WITHIN A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF FEET, RIGHT? THIS IS BEYOND THAT.

WE'RE SAYING YOUR PROPERTY LINE IS HERE AND THE SEWER IS THERE YOU GOT TO CONNECT IF YOU ARE ABUTTING BUT IF YOU ARE OFF AND YOUR SEPTIC TANK FAILS YOU DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO UNLESS IN A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF FEET FROM IT, BUT WHAT TRIGGERS THIS IS THE FAILURE OF THE ACCEPT IS TICK TANK.

>> I THINK WE NEED MORE CLARITY. THIS ONE IS NOT READY TO ME.

>> SO SEPTIC FAILS AND YOU'RE GOING TO CONSTRUCT A LATERAL.

WHO PAYS FOR THE LATERAL? >> IT USUALLY GETS ABSORBED IN

THE C C UA SYSTEM. >> WE'RE GOING TO GET PRECISE

HELP ON THIS ONE. >> IF YOU HAVE TO RUN A LATERAL FIVE HUNDRED FEET THAT WILL COST A LOT.

IT'S NOT A SERVICE LATERAL. IT WILL BECOME A MAIN.

THERE'S MULTIPLE USERS THAT CAN BENEFIT.

CCUA WOULD TYPICALLY FINANCE IT AND AS THE OTHER FOUR HOUSES CONNECT, WE WOULD RECOUP OUR MONEY OR REIMBURSE SAID WHOEVER

PAID FOR IT. >> SO THE 500 FOOT LENGTH SEWER MAIN OR LATERAL WOULD BE RECOVERED FROM CONNECTION FEES.

>> CORRECT. AS EACH HOME CONNECTED THEY WOULD PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE OR PORTION.

>> HOW DO YOU MAKE THE DECISION ON THE THEY HAVE THAT CHOICE SO IN YOUR DESCRIPTION, IF THE MAIN IS HERE, SOMEONE FOUR HOUSES IN, SEPTIC TANK FAILS, THEY DECIDE THEY WANT THAT CONNECTION, BUT CCUA DOES NOT HAVE THAT IN THE STRATEGIC PLAN, WHO MAKES THAT

DECISION? >> I AM NOT UNDERSTANDING THE QUESTION. I HAVE A MAP THAT MAY MAKE THIS CLEAR IF YOU HAVE IT. IS THAT OUR PURPLE MAP?

>> NO. >> IF NOT IT'S OKAY.

[02:50:06]

SO IN TODAY'S CURRENT CODE OR POLICY THEY WOULD NOT BE REQUIRED TO CONNECT THEY WOULD GET ASEPTIC TANK REPLACEMENT AND THEY REALLY DON'T HAVE THE OPTION BECAUSE I KNOW YOU ALL HAVE A STRATEGIC PLAN THAT YOU JUST WORKED ON AND THERE'S AREAS YOU ARE IN AND YOU ARE GOING INTO MORE AND SOME YOU ARE NOT.

>> CORRECT. CHANGING IT TO 500 THOUGH WOULD CHANGE THAT. WHERE AS RIGHT NOW IT ABUTS.

>> WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO LOOK AT OR WHAT ARE THE COST IMPLICATIONS TO THE UTILITY OR THE HOME ENTER SO WE CAN BRING BACK AND DISCUSS BOTH OF THOSE AND WHERE WE CAN OFFER EXTENSIONS. THERE'S OTHER PLACES WHERE YOU KNOW SOMEBODY THREE HOUSES IN MIGHT WANT IT AND WE'RE WILLING TO RUN A LINE DOWN THERE. MAYBE WE SHOULD BE DOING IT.

I THINK THAT'S HOW THIS GOT STARTED IN THE FIRST PLACE.

>> SO WE'LL HAVE THE BENEFIT OF YOUR WISE TOMORROW IN THREE

WEEKS? >> WE WILL ENDEAVOR TO DO THAT.

[LAUGHTER]>> I HAVE A QUESTION. >> WILL THIS AFFECT ALL THE 209 PEOPLE FROM CROSS CREEK, RUSSELL ROAD?

THE 500 FEET? >> THAT AS NEW SUBDIVISION SO

THERE'S MORE THAN 50 HOUSES? >> NO.

THE 209 PEOPLE THAT ARE RIGHT UP NEXT TO CROSS CREEK NOW THAT HAS WATER, WOULD THAT AFFECT THEM IF IT ABUTS AND THEIRS FAILS?

>> THEY WOULD HAVE TO REPLACE. >> IF IT ABUTS.

YES. >> SO THIS IS A LOT OF TALK ABOUT SEPTIC, BUT WHAT ABOUT WATER? WATER IS REALLY MORE OF THE RESOURCE, YOU KNOW? WHEN SOMEONE USE, AS WELL WE HAVE NO ONE KNOWS HOW MUCH THEY USE OR IF THEY HAVE A PROBLEM OR WHATEVER AND I WOULD THINK THAT AT SOME POINT WE'D WANT TO HAVE A CONVERSATION ON THE A WATER LINE IS AVAILABLE YOU CAN CONNECT.

>> THIS TOPIC FROM WORKSHOP WAS ALL ABOUT SEWER SO WE DIDN'T ADDRESS WATER AT ALL, BUT WE CAN TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.

>> DO YOU GENERALLY HAVE A WATER LINE WHEREVER YOU HAVE A SEWER

LEADERSHIP? >> NO.

NOT ALWAYS. >> OKAY.

THAT KIND OF SURPRISES ME. >> IN KEYSTONE THEY HAVE WATER

LINES WITHOUT SEWER LINES. >> WELL, THAT'S KEYSTONE.

>> OF COURSE AS THE COUNTY BECOMES MORE MASTER PLAN WITH THE DEVELOPMENTS THEY DO GO TOGETHER IN THE LARGER

DEVELOPMENTS. >> YOU ARE PUTTING IN THE RETURN

WASTEWATER USE PRE-USE. >> ALL THREE SERVICES GO

TOGETHER. >> WHEN YOU DIG THE HOLE YOU

MIGHT AS WELL PUT IT IN. >> AS IT RELATES TO SEPTIC TANKS THERE'S A LOT OF LEGACY STUFF WHERE PEOPLE HAD SEPTIC TANKS.

>> ALRIGHT. LET'S KILL THIS ONE.

>> IN CONCLUSION THAT'S WHERE WE ARE.

WE HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH MELISSA AND WE'LL HAVE YOU SOME CRITERIA AND INFORMATION MOVING FOR

FORWARD. >> SO IN ABOUT THREE WEEKS WE'LL HAVE THE ANSWERS AND YOU'LL BE ABLE TO FORMULATE A RECOMMENDATION AFTER THAT, RIGHT?

>> WE'LL BE ABLE TO FORMULATE A RECOMMENDATION AFTER THAT.

YES, SIR. >> OKAY.

I THINK THAT GETS US TO THE END. A FEW MINUTES TO LUNCH.

WE HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD COUNTY MANAGER?>> NO, SIR.

>> DID YOU WANT TO GO OVER THIS NOW OR LATER?>> LATER.

YEAH. >> VERY GOOD.

>> DO WE NEED ANOTHER PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD?

>> NOT REQUIRED. >> WAIT.

[COMMISSIONERS' COMMENTS]

>> COMMISSIONER COMMENTS? >> I JUST HAD THREE THINGS I WANTED YOU ALL TO CONSIDER AS YOU MOVE FORWARD THAT WERE NOT

[02:55:02]

ONE OF THEM IS HOA'S. HOA'S AND I KNOW THAT WE'RE NOT SEEING AS MANY OF THEMED TODAY GOTTEN FEEDBACK ON.

ONE OF THEM IS HOA'S. HOA'S AND I KNOW THAT WE'RE NOT SEEING AS MANY OF THEM, BUT I KEEP GETTING PHONE CALLS FROM PEOPLE, HOA'S THAT EXISTED AND GO DEFUNKED AND NO ONE OWNS THE ROADS. THERE'S NO MAINTENANCE OF THE SUBDIVISIONS SO AS YOU ADDRESS OUR CODES AND I KNOW COURTNEY LEFT, BUT NOT YOU, BUT THE OTHER COURTNEY, BUT AS THEY ARE LOOKING AT THAT, I DON'T KNOW WHAT CAN BE SET UP BUT IF WE HAVE TO ALLOW HOA'S'S IT'S NOT A PROBLEM NOW, BUT DOWN THE ROAD AND THEN WORKING WITH MUNICIPALITIES.

THERE WAS A BIG S IT'S NOT A PROBLEM NOW, BUT DOWN THE ROAD AND THEN WORKING WITH MUNICIPALITIES.

THERE WAS A BIGS IT'S NOT A PROBLEM NOW, BUT DOWN THE ROAD AND THEN WORKING WITH MUNICIPALITIES.

THERE WAS A BIG IT'S NOT A PROBLEM NOW, BUT DOWN THE ROAD AND THEN WORKING WITH MUNICIPALITIES.

THERE WAS A BIG HUBBUB GOING ON AND THERE WERE NOT CONVERSATIONS WITH TO MY KNOWLEDGE WITH PUBLIC SAFETY AND THINGS WERE DONE AND I KNOW THE CITY OF SPRINGS IS LOOKING FOR EXPANSIONS AND I UNDERSTAND THE MUNICIPALITIES DESIRES TO INCREASE THEIR TAX BASE BUT IF THERE'S A WAY THAT WE CAN REQUIRE THAT THEY HAVE TO WORK WITH STAFF, I'M NOT INTERESTED IN REVIEWING IT AS MUCH AS I CARE A LOT THAT THEY TALK TO YOU ALL ABOUT THOSE THINGS AND WHAT THE BURDEN WILL BE ON THE COUNTY TAXPAYER THAT DOESN'T LIVE IN THE MUNICIPALITY.

THE FINAL THING AND WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT BEFORE BUT WHEN I THINK OF WATER QUALITY, I KNOW THERE HAS BEEN LOTS OF CONVERSATIONS WITH THE ALGAE BLOOMS AND LEON COUNTY HAS DONE A SEPARATE WATER WEBSITE ON THE WATER QUALITY OF THEIR WATERWAYS AND IT WOULD BE NICE IF WE COULD LOOK AT DOING SOMETHING LIKE THAT LIVE TIME WHERE PEOPLE KNOW THEY HAVE SOMEWHERE TO GO IF THEY HAVEN'T GOTTEN THE ALERT THAT THERE'S AN ALGAE BLOOM, BUT THEY WANT TO RECREATE IN THOSE BODIES OF WATER.

SOMETHING LIKE THAT. >> OKAY.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.