Jan 06, 2022 Charter Review Commission

[CALL TO ORDER]

[WELCOME]

[00:00:12]

>> GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE. WELCOME TO THE CLAY COUNTY CHARTER REVIEW COMMISSION. IN OUR MEETING TONIGHT WE WILL CALL THIS TO ORDER NOW. I LIKE TO START WITH A MOMENT OF SILENCE, AND THEN WE WILL FOLLOW THAT WITH THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. WOULD YOU PLEASE STAND FOR THE MOMENT OF SILENCE? THANK YOU.

MITCH? >> I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION, UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.

>> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU FOR TAKING TIME FROM YOUR BUSY SCHEDULES TO JOIN US TONIGHT.

WE REALLY APPRECIATE IT. WE'VE GOT A NUMBER OF ITEMS ON THE AGENDA. WE WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THROUGH THEM AS QUICK AS POSSIBLE. I WOULD LIKE TO START OFF WITH INTRODUCTIONS. WE WILL START ON THE WAY OVER ON THE RIGHT. DEPUTY, YOU HAVE THE HONOR TONIGHT OF INTRODUCING YOURSELF.

WE APPRECIATE IT. WELCOME.

THANK YOU, DEPUTY. >>.

>> I AM MITCH TIMBERLAKE. >> BO NORTON, CHAIR.

(VOTE CALLED). >> WE HAVE HONORED GUESTS WITHOUT STARTING WITH COURTNEY GRIMM.

THANK YOU. TERESA, KRISTI, MS. CRANE, GOOD TO SEE YOU. (ROLL CALLED) THANK YOU ALL FOR JOINING US. YOU HAVE VERY BUSY SCHEDULES BUT WE APPRECIATE IT. THE FIRST ITEM IS ROLL CALL.

[APPROVAL OF MINUTES]

AS EVERYONE HAD A CHANCE TO LOOK TO THE MINUTES?

>> MOTION TO APPROVE. >> TO HAVE A SECOND? WE HAD A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MINUTES? ADDITIONS, DELETIONS, CORRECTIONS? SAYING NONE, I'D LIKE TO CALL FOR A VOTE FOR APPROVAL.

(VOTE CALLED)

>> OKAY. THEY ARE APPROVED.

[PUBLIC COMMENT]

AND I WOULD LIKE TO START -- WE HAVE ONE CARD HERE FROM MR. BETZ. IF YOU'D LIKE TO COME FORWARD.

YOU WILL HAVE THREE MINUTES ONCE WE START AND WHEN YOU SEE A BLINKING RED LIGHT, THAT MEANS YOUR TIME IS ALMOST UP AND WHEN IT GOES STUDY, WE WILL SAY THANK YOU AND ASK YOU TO PLEASE HAVE A SEAT. THERE IS GOOD.

ALL RIGHT MR. BETZ. PLEASE START WITH YOUR NAME AND

ADDRESS. >> I LIVE AT 2942 LONGLEAF RANCH CIR. IN MIDDLEBURG. IT'S GOOD TO BE HERE.

I WISH EVERYBODY A HAPPY NEW YEAR.

IMAGINE YOU ARE ADVISING A GALAXY FAR, FAR AWAY.

ON BEST PRACTICES AND GOVERNANCE.

CAN YOU USE YOUR IMAGINATION AND GO WITH ME ON THIS? BECAUSE YOU TAKE PRIDE IN YOUR WORK, YOU WOULD RECOMMEND A GOVERNANCE STRUCTURE THAT FRUSTRATES CONFLICTS OF INTEREST, ENTRENCHED POLITICAL INTERESTS, PERSONALITY CULTS.

AND CONDUCT OUTSIDE THE SUNSHINE.

TO AVOID THESE PROBLEMS YOU WOULD HAVE ALL ELECTED

[00:05:01]

21ST CENTURY AMERICAN NORMS POINT TO A MAXIMUM OF EIGHT YEARS FOR ELECTIVE OFFICIALS. SUCH AS THE CASE FOR OUR GOVERNOR, THE CABINET, LEGISLATURE, AND THE COMMISSIONERS WHO APPOINTED ALL OF THE.

THIS BRINGS INTO PLAY CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICES.

THEY ARE NOT ALIGNED WITH THE 21ST-CENTURY NORMS. FOR THE SAKE OF GOOD GOVERNANCE, FOR THE SAKE OF HER BEST EFFORTS ON BEHALF OF OUR COUNTY, BRING OUR CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICES UNDER AN EIGHT YEAR, TWO-TERM FRAMEWORK.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER PUBLIC COMMENTS? OKAY. I'M CLOSING PUBLIC COMMENT AND

[OLD BUSINESS]

AND I WOULD JUST LIKE TO MAKE A NOTE HERE.

OUR AGENDA SHOWS ALL BUSINESS AND ITEMS UNDER LISTED THAT'S ACTUALLY NEW BUSINESS AND WE WILL START WITH ANY OLD BUSINESS FIRST. IS THERE ANY TO BE BROUGHT UP? SEEING NONE, CLASSIFIED THE NEXT SECTION AS NEW BUSINESS AND WE WILL START WITH A POINT OF DISCUSSION TONIGHT ON LEGISLATIVE BRANCH. AND AS YOU SEE, THERE ARE FOUR ITEMS THERE. ONE IS REGARDING THE COUNTY COMMISSION COMPOSITION, TERM LIMITS, THE MINIMUM QUALIFICATIONS, AND SALARIES. AND I HAVE ASKED BOTH TO JOIN US TONIGHT AND THEY HAVE GRACIOUSLY DECIDED TO DO SO.

AND THE POINT BEING THAT IN ADDITION TO OUR DISCUSSION, YOU WILL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO ASK THEM QUESTIONS AND ASKED THEIR OPINIONS ON THESE DIFFERENT TOPICS.

I THINK YOU'LL FIND IT ILLUMINATING TO HEAR WHAT THEY THINK ON THEM AFTER HAVING BEEN IN OFFICE.

MR. BOLA FOR SEVEN YEARS. SO THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE A CERTAIN PERSPECTIVE AND OBVIOUSLY IT MIGHT BE DIFFERENT THAN OURS BUT CERTAINLY WORTH HAVING THEIR PERSPECTIVE PRESENTED TONIGHT. THAT SAID, LET'S START WITH THE FIRST ONE ON THE COMPOSITION. THE ITEM THAT WAS BROUGHT UP EARLY ON TO BE DISCUSSED SHOULD BEHAVE THE COMPOSITION OF THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS THE SAME, FOR EXAMPLE, FIVE VERSUS INCREASING OR DECREASING. IN THE SECOND PART OF THAT WOULD BE KEEPING IT AT THE DISTRICT LEVEL OR SHOULD WE HAVE ANY LARGE? SO WITH THAT I WANT TO OPEN IT UP. ARE THERE ANY COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD BEFORE WE ASK THEIR OPINIONS?

>> WE AS A BOARD HAVE A OPPORTUNITY TO COME IN AFTER?

>> I WOULD ASK MR. BOLA COUNTY COMMISSIONERS CHAIR.

THANK YOU. >> I DON'T HAVE A SCRIPT HERE.

LET'S START WITH COMPOSITION. >> IN MY EXPERIENCE IF YOU WANT TO TALK SOMETHING TO DEBBIE BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THE COMMITTEE TO TALK ABOUT IT. IF YOU WANT A GOVERNMENT THAT DOES NOT RESPOND QUICKLY TO EVERYDAY PROBLEMS, THAT'S THE WAY TO DO IT. I THINK THE FEWER FOLKS IN A COMMISSION, THE BETTER. YOU KNOW, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I'M COMING FROM. SO I KNOW THE LECTERN DECIDED WE NEEDED SEVEN COMMISSIONERS ONCE UPON A TIME, AND THEY IMMEDIATELY REVERSED THE POSITION AND I'M NOT SURE WHY.

BUT I WAS ALWAYS IN THE CAMP THAT FELT LIKE LESS IS BETTER.

I THINK AS FAR AS THE REPRESENTATION ISSUE THOSE, I'VE PROBABLY -- I HAD THE BIGGEST DISTRICT, AND IT GETS PRETTY BUSY. IF WE NEED MORE PEOPLE RESPONDING TO THE CONSTITUENCY, RECOMMEND WE GIVE EACH OF THE COMMISSIONERS MAY BE AN ASSISTANT SIMILAR TO WHAT THEY HAVE IN JACKSONVILLE TO HANDLE A LOT OF THE DAY TO DAY STUFF, AND THAT WAY YOU STILL HAVE A FIVE MEMBER GROUP DEALING WITH DELIBERATIONS AND MAKING DECISIONS.

>> OKAY. VERY GOOD.

[00:10:08]

I HAVE FOUR FOLKS WHO CHOSE TO SERVE IN 2018, AND I THINK ALL FOUR ARE STILL TALKING TO ME AFTER THEY GOT DONE.

SO I THINK YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO SURVIVE THIS.

I AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER BOLLA THAT FIVE IS THE IDEAL NUMBER FOR US AT THIS POINT IN TIME. MOST OF THE COUNTIES IN THE STATE USE FIVE IS THE NUMBER. THERE ARE LARGER COUNTIES THAT HAVE SEVEN OR A VARIATION OF THERE.

IN ORANGE COUNTY, YOU HAVE A MAYOR THAT SITS ON THE BOARD ALONG WITH SEVEN OTHER COMMISSIONERS.

BUT I THINK THE NUMBER CAN CERTAINLY HANDLE AND EVEN MORE I HEAR THAT ALL THE TIME THAT PERHAPS BECAUSE WE'VE GOT INCREASING NUMBERS OF PEOPLE IN THE COUNTY THAT FIVE COMMISSIONERS COULD NOT HANDLE IT.

WE CERTAINLY COULD HANDLE IT IF YOU HAVE THE RIGHT SPORTS STAFF AS THE COMMISSIONER INDICATED. SO FROM THAT STANDPOINT, WE DON'T WANT TO GET INTO A SITUATION WHERE THEY HAD 19 PEOPLE ON THE CITY COUNCIL LIKE THEY DO IN JACKSONVILLE, AND YOU CAN'T GET ANYTHING PASSED IN TERMS OF THAT PARTICULAR BODY, AND I WOULD HATE TO SEE US MOVE FURTHER IN THAT WAY.

BUT I THINK FIVE WORKS, AND IN TERMS OF CONSTITUENT SERVICE, YOU KNOW, EVERY COUNTY HANDLES IT A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY.

IN ORANGE COUNTY THEY HAVE 900,000 PEOPLE EACH COMMISSIONER EVEN THOUGH THEY HAVE 7+ A MAYOR IT COMMISSIONER HAS THREE STAFF MEMBERS. NYWHERE BETWEEN 35 AND $65,000 A YEAR. IN OSCEOLA COUNTY WHICH IS ABOUT 326,000 PEOPLE, THEY HAVE FIVE COMMISSIONERS IN EACH COMMISSIONER HAS AN ASSISTANT. WE HAVE ONE ASSISTANT, ALTHOUGH SOMETIMES SHE APPEARS TO BE MORE THAN ONE PERSON TO DEAL WITH ALL FIVE OF US. AND IF SHE'S NOT BEING PULLED ASIDE TO HELP OUT SOMEWHERE ELSE IN COUNTY GOVERNMENT.

SO I AGREED. FIVE IS NOT, I DON'T THINK, A PROBLEM. I THINK THAT AS THE COUNTY CONTINUES TO GROW, THAT MAY BE SOMETHING YOU MIGHT WANT TO CONSIDER. YOU KNOW, TWO ADDITIONAL POSITIONS THAT WERE VOTED ON BY THE VOTERS -- I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT YEAR IT WAS BUT IT WAS A PERMANENT SEAT AND A PERMANENT CHAIRMAN. THE VOTERS VOTED IN FAVOR OF IT AND THEN WAS STRUCK DOWN AND WE TALKED TO ROB BRADLEY ABOUT IT AND IT WAS THE SHORTEST CAREER ON THE COUNTY COMMISSION IN THE HISTORY OF THE COUNTY. IT'S BASICALLY NOT EVEN ONE DAY. SO GOT ELECTED AND DID NOT SERVE. BUT I DON'T THINK THAT'S A NUMBER THAT NEEDS TO BE CHANGED AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

THERE'S OTHER RAMIFICATIONS IS BEGINNING TO SOME OF THE OTHER TOPICS YOU WILL COVER AND I WILL TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT BECAUSE IT DOES IMPACT PERHAPS THE COST OF RUNNING THE GOVERNMENT IF YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE ADDITIONAL SUPPORT STAFF.

BUT IN TERMS OF THE ACTUAL WHERE THE RUBBER MEETS THE ROAD AND PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY MAKE DECISIONS, I DON'T THINK FIVE IS A PARTICULAR PROBLEM AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

>> HOW MANY VARIOUS COMMISSIONS DO YOU SUPPORT? THERE'S THE PLANNING COMMISSION.

I KNOW THAT. >> (INDISCERNIBLE).

>> THANK YOU. OKAY.

SO YOU HEARD THE OPINIONS OF TWO BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS.

THE FLOOR IS OPEN NOW FOR DISCUSSION.

>> I'VE BEEN LIVING IN THIS COUNTY FOR 35 YEARS, BUT THE COUNTY HAS GROWN EXPONENTIALLY, AND THERE'S SOMETHING TO BE SAID FOR HIRING ASSISTANTS. BUT IF YOU TAKE A STEP BACK AND YOU ARE NOT INVOLVED AT ALL IN GOVERNMENT, YOU'RE JUST A PERSON WHO WANTS A VOICE, THEY DON'T WANT AN ASSISTANT.

I'M NOT SURE THAT THAT WORKS FOR THE GENERAL PUBLIC VERY WELL. BUT IT IS UNSUSTAINABLE FOR FIVE PEOPLE, IF THE POPULATION KEEPS GROWING, TO CONTINUE.

BUT WE HIRED AND FIRED DEBACLE OF THE SEVEN AND I STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT HAPPENED WITH THAT.

I GUESS THE QUESTION I HAVE FOR COMMISSIONER BOLLA AND COMMISSIONER SELLA IS YOU CONSIDER THIS A FULL-TIME JOB

IS STATUTORILY A FULL-TIME JOB? >> IT'S AFTER THE COMMISSION

[00:15:09]

IF YOU PUT IT ALL ON THE LINE, WHEN YOU START DOING THIS YOUR FIRST TERM YOU ARE TRYING TO DO EVERYTHING THAT COMES AT YOU.

AND YOU CAN'T DO IT. THERE'S NOT ENOUGH TIME TO GET IT ALL DONE.F YOU GO TO EVERY RIBBON-CUTTING AND EVERY POLITICAL EVENT AND PLUS ALL OF THE OTHER RESPONSIBILITIES AS FAR AS THE LEGISLATIVE STUFF, IT'S REALLY TOUGH.

BUT AS YOU ARE IN THIS JOB LONGER, YOU UNDERSTAND OR ARE YOU GET WHAT'S IMPORTANT TO DO, AND WHAT YOU CAN LET GO.

AND DOING THAT, YOU CAN GET IT DOWN -- I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT MYSELF NOW. I CAN USUALLY GET IT DOWN TO ABOUT THREE FULL-TIME DAYS OF WORK DURING THE WEEK.

TO GET MOST OF IT DONE. AND THAT'S WITH A LOT OF HELP FROM TERESA.HE WORST PART OF MY JOB RIGHT NOW IS MY SCHEDULING. I SPENT ALL SUNDAY AFTERNOON PRETTY MUCH FIGURING OUT WHERE I'M SUPPOSED TO BE THE REST OF THE WEEK, AND THEN I GOT THE BOOK, IF WE GET A PHONE BOOK EVERY TWO WEEKS TO READ WITH ALL OF THE STUFF IN IT THAT'S GOING TO BE ON THE AGENDA, AND HAVE GOT TO RESEARCH ALL OF THAT STUFF IF I'VE GOT ANY QUESTIONS.

OBVIOUSLY IF YOU'RE IN THE JOB FOR A WHILE YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT'S IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT WHAT HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE BY SOMEBODY ELSE. IT'S PART OF MATURING IN THIS TERM LIMITED SITUATION. WHEN YOU GET TO THE END, IT IS EASIER THAN WHEN YOU START. THE NEWER COMMISSIONERS ARE GOING AT IT PRETTY MUCH FULL-TIME.

BUT AS YOU GET INTO IT A LITTLE BIT FURTHER, IT GETS EASIER.

I THINK THAT'S PRETTY MUCH IT. >> MY CONCERN IS THE GROWTH OF CLAY COUNTY, WHICH IS JUST KINDA GENERIC.

WITH REGARDS TO THE AMOUNT OF TIME.

GOING TO USE LAKE ASBURY AS AN EXAMPLE.

THIS DOESN'T EVEN TALK ABOUT SARATOGA SPRINGS AND EVERYTHING ELSE GOING ON AFTER THAT. MY POINT IS PLANNING AHEAD MIGHT BE A GOOD THING. MAYBE NOT WITH TWO EXTRA AT-LARGE AND SOME PERMANENT FIGUREHEAD AT THE COUNTER.

CALLING THE SHOTS FOREVER AND EVER.

I'M CONCERNED ABOUT YOUR WORKLOAD TWO YEARS FROM NOW.

>> I THINK YOU HAVE TO SEPARATE THIS.

YOU'VE GOT RESPONSE AND YOU'VE GOT MORE OR LESS LEGISLATIVE BACK-OFFICE KIND OF THINGS LIKE A LOT OF THE STUFF IS DONE BY OUR STAFF. AND IT COMES TO US OR ARE YOU CAN SIT DOWN AND READ IT. THE STUFF THE TRANSACTIONAL THINGS WITH CONSTITUENTS, THAT TAKES A LOT OF TIME BECAUSE YOU VEHICLE SOMETHING SHE MAY NOT BE UP ON.

WHEN THEY START COMING YOU RESEARCH THE FIRST ONE.

I WILL GET 10 CALLS DURING THE HURRICANE.

MY PHONE WAS RINGING OFF ALL DAY LONG.

THE QUESTIONS AND THE PROBLEMS WERE VERY SIMILAR IN NATURE.

IT'S COMING AT US IN A WAY YOU HAD TO BE THERE FOR IT BUT IT WASN'T A PROBLEM FIGURING OUT WHAT TO DO.

TERESA HANDLES A LOT OF THAT STUFF.

WE GET A CALL ABOUT A LIBRARY AND THEY WILL FUNNEL IT TO THE LIBRARY TIME AND IF THAT DOESN'T WORK, THEN I WOULD GET INVOLVED IN FOLLOW-UP. AND THAT'S KIND OF HOW I ADDRESS IT. EACH COMMISSIONER DOES IT

DIFFERENTLY. >> FIRST TO THE ANSWER OF DEPUTIES QUESTION THAT SHE SAID SHE DOESN'T WANT TO TALK TO A PERSON, IT USUALLY WHERE IT STARTS BECAUSE IN MANY CASES

[00:20:02]

HERE ANECDOTALLY THIS IS A PART-TIME JOB, ALTHOUGH MY TIMECARD WOULD INDICATE A PART-TIME JOB.

YOU KNOW, I PROBABLY PUT IN 30 TO 40 HOURS A WEEK AND THAT'S BY CHOICE, AND SOMETIMES IT'S MORE.

SOMETIMES IT'S LESS, IT DEPENDS ON THE WEEK.

SOMETIMES IT'S A LOT MORE DEPENDING ON WHAT KIND OF PRESSURE. I GOT TWO EMAILS TODAY SOMEBODY SAYING THAT THEY ARE AGAINST TENURE TERMS WERE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT CAME FROM BUT I HAD TO COME THE GUY DOWN BECAUSE AS WE WATCHED THE MEETING, A TERM OF 10 YEARS BEING FOSTERED BY ANYBODY AT THIS POINT. THE BOTTOM LINE IS, YEAH.

I THINK WE CAN TD WITH SUPPORT STAFF DOING SOME RESEARCH TO GET BACK TO US SO WE GET BACK TO A CONSTITUENT, I THINK THAT WOULD WORK. THEY START THEIR MEETINGS AT 9:00 IN THE MORNING AND COME BACK FOR FOUR HOURS IN THE AFTERNOON AND THEY CAN HANDLE THEIR BUSINESS ON THOSE MEETING DAYS. OSCEOLA COUNTY THEY HAVE SO MANY PLANNING AND ZONING ISSUES THEY MADE A THIRD TIME DURING THE MONTH AND ONLY DO PLANNING AND ZONING ISSUES ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY SO THEY HAVE TWO REGULAR READING MEETINGS AND REGULAR MEETING WHICH WOULD BE THE REQUEST FOR DIFFERENCES IN ZONING AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.

SO IT CAN BE DONE AND I DON'T THINK THAT YOU WOULD OVERWORK COMMISSIONERS. AS THE CHAIRMAN INDICATES YOU SORT OF GET HANDLE AFTER A WHILE AS TO WHAT YOU CAN DO TO SORT OF SHAPE TIME OFF BUT GET THE JOB DONE IN TERMS OF DIFFERENT RESPONSIBILITIES IN TERMS OF REQUESTS.

I THINK THE HARDEST PART IS AS NEW COMMISSIONER IS WHO TO TURN 2 TO GET ANSWERS. A LOT OF TIMES YOU'RE SPINNING YOUR WHEELS AND DOING YOUR OWN RESEARCH AND YOU WALK INTO SOMEWHERE AND WITHIN 15 OR 20 MINUTES GET THE ANSWER WHILE YOU WERE SPINNING YOUR WHEELS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE ANSWER IS TO GET TO THE CONSTITUENTS.

SO THE BOTTOM LINE IS I THINK WE WORK A LOT? YES. I THINK AS WE MOVE FORWARD, IN 2010 WE WOULD HAVE 190,000 AND WE WENT UP 33,000 RESIDENTS IN 10 YEARS. MUCH SMALLER THAN A LOT OF THE CHARTER COUNTIES ARE THAT HAVE ONLY FIVE COMMISSIONERS.

SO IT CAN BE DONE AND IT HAS TO BE DONE THE RIGHT WAY IN SPORTS STRUCTURE AND YOU STILL WOULD LOSE THE PERSONAL FEEL IN TERMS OF WHEN YOU WANTED TO GET A HOLD OF YOUR COMMISSIONER.

YOU COULD STILL DO THAT. SO THAT'S SORT OF MY THOUGHT ON

THAT. >> (INDISCERNIBLE)

(INDISCERNIBLE). >> IF EACH COMMISSIONER HAD THEIR OWN STAFF PERSON, WHAT DUTIES WOULD THEY BE EXPECTED TO DO? CAN YOU EXPAND ON WHAT MR.

BOLLA WAS SAYING EARLIER? >> A LOT OF THAT WOULD BE IN TERMS OF RESEARCH, IN TERMS OF HANDLING THE FIRST CALL TO MAKE A DETERMINATION AS TO WHETHER THE COMMISSIONER TD SOMETIMES PEOPLE CALL AND THEY DON'T WHO THEY ARE CALLING.

SO WE GET THIS CAUSED BECAUSE THEY SOMETIMES DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY DEFINITELY WANT. I WILL PICK UP THE PHONE AND

[00:25:02]

SO I THINK THOSE AREN'T THE KIND OF THINGS.

IF WE HAD AN EXTRA PERSON TO HELP IN THE OFFICE, I THINK THAT'S ALL WE WOULD NEED AT THIS POINT.

AGAIN THAT'S LOOKING FORWARD IN 10 YEARS, MORE PEOPLE WILL WE HAVE AND WHAT DOES THAT OFFICE LOOK LIKE? THAT'S GOING TO HAVE TO GROW WITH THE REST OF THE RESPONSIBILITY FROM THE COMMISSIONERS.

>> IF WE CREATED THAT POSITION ONE PERSON DO YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE SUFFICIENT TO TAKE THE LOAD OFF.

>> TODAY, I THINK IT WOULD BE MORE THAN SUFFICIENT OR MORE THAN WE NEED. I DON'T THINK WE WOULD NEED ONE PER. I MIGHT GET DISAGREEMENT FROM THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS BUT TERESA CAN HANDLE IT.

THAT'S PROBABLY WHY WE HAVEN'T LOOKED TO ADDITIONAL STAFF.

BUT I THINK AT SOME POINT IN THE NEAR FUTURE WE WERE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT TODAY, HOW THAT WOULD WORK AND I ORIGINALLY HAD A CONCEPT OF A SECOND PERSON BEING AN OMNIBUS MAN SO THEY CAN TRACK WHEN SOMEBODY CALLS WHERE THEY CAN GO TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM AND THEY CAN MAKE SURE THAT PROJECT IS BEING TAKEN CARE OF BUT WE HAVE SUFFERING ONLY INSTITUTED IS GOING TO TRACK THOSE THINGS FOR US WILL BE EASIER FOR US TO MAKE SURE IF WE TURN SOMEBODY OVER TO A DEPARTMENT HAD TAKEN AN ANSWER OR LEASE A SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM AND THE PROBLEM HAS BEEN CORRECTED AT SOME POINT.

BUT A LOT OF IT IS RESEARCH AND TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHERE THINGS ARE AND IN PREPPING US FOR MEETINGS TO MAKE SURE WHEN WE GO INTO A MEETING TO VOTE ON SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE AS MUCH INFORMATION AS WE NEED. AND SO I CAN GO GET MY BOOK.

IT'S ABOUT THE STICK IN TERMS OF JUST ONE MEETING AND THAT'S AN EVEN IN HEAVY OBJECTIVE FOR THE MEETING.

THOSE OF THE THINGS I COMMISSIONERS TALKING ABOUT IN TERMS OF PREPARATION AND GETTING READY AND THE HISTORY NOW AS MUCH ABOUT ALL OF THOSE 25 OR 30 OR DIFFERENT AGENDA

ITEMS AS POSSIBLE. >> TERESA, WHEN IS THE LAST TIME HE TOOK A THREE WEEK VACATION?

>> (INDISCERNIBLE). >> THANK YOU.

ENOUGH SAID. >> THE CONCEPT OF ADDING STAFF REALLY IS THE DATE THAT LIES WITH YOU RATHER THAN THE CRC.

>> ABSOLUTELY. THAT'S AN ADMINISTRATIVE TASK.

THAT WORKS WITH US GOING TO THE COUNTY MANAGER, MAKING THE CASE, AND I'M SURE WE COULD. I THINK WE'RE CLOSE TO THAT AT

THIS POINT. >> JUST FOR THE STAFF TO REALIZE THAT WAS IN THE CRC, THE COUNTY CHARTER AND THEN THE STAFF IS LEFT SPECIFICALLY FOR THE COUNTY MANAGER TO MANAGE.

OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS REGARDING THIS WAS ON THE COMPOSITION.

>> JUST TO CLARIFY. THE STAFF IS A JOB OF THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS AND TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE BUDGET FOR

ANOTHER STAFF PERSON VERSUS. >> CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, THAT IS THE CASE YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE.

>> WE DON'T ACTUALLY TELL THEM POINT BLANK IN TERMS OF BUDGET HOW MANY FULL-TIME EMPLOYEES YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE.

WE WILL NEED SOMEBODY ELSE THERE IS ONLY THREE PEOPLE APPROPRIATE COUNTY COMMISSION AND THAT IS THE COUNTY ATTORNEY THE AUDITOR AND THE COUNTY MANAGER.

>> THANK YOU FOR THE CLARIFICATION.

>> SO THE PURPOSE OF THIS POINT OF DISCUSSION WAS ON THE COMPOSITION, WHETHER OR NOT CRC SHOULD RECOMMEND OR INCREASE IT. IS THERE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION

ON THAT? >> FOR CLARIFICATION, HELPED ME

[00:30:02]

>> IT VARIES DURING THE HURRICANE EVENT WE WERE ON 24/7. I SPENT ABOUT THREE DAYS A WEEK WORKING FOR COUNTY BUSINESS DIRECTLY.

I GET OVER 100 EMAILS PER DAY AND ONE OF MY BIGGEST PROBLEMS IS TURNING THROUGH ALL OF THAT STUFF AND FIGURING OUT WHAT'S IMPORTANT TO ANSWER AND SOMEBODY IS TRYING TO LOBBY ME AND I DON'T REALLY CARE ABOUT THAT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

WE GET ABOUT THREE OR FOUR DIFFERENT BRIEFINGS A DAY IN DIFFERENT PLACES TRYING TO TELL US WHAT WE OUGHT TO THINK.

SOME OF IT'S GOOD TO READ BECAUSE YOU PICK UP IDEAS BUT A LOT OF IT IS SOMEBODY TRYING TO TWIST YOUR ARM TO GET YOU TO DO SOMETHING. THE STAFF THAT NEEDS AN ACTUAL RESPONSE, TERESA HAS BEEN PRETTY GOOD ABOUT READING THAT FOR ME AND SHE WILL SCREEN SOME OF THEM UP AS A REQUEST FOR AN APPOINTMENT. SHE KNOWS WHICH ONES I WILL TAKE AND WHICH ONES I WILL DOCK.

SO SHE'S PRETTY GOOD AT THAT. SO I WOULD SAY THREE FULL DAYS A WEEK FOR ME. I COULD SPEND FULL TIME DOING THIS EASILY AND DO EVERYTHING. BUT THIS IS A PART-TIME JOB.

I AM RETIRED. SOME OF THIS TIME BELONGS TO ME. SO THAT'S WHERE I'M COMING FROM. I MEAN, I DON'T NEED THIS MONEY. I'M DOING THIS TO STAY ACTIVE AND TO HELP PEOPLE. BUT AS FAR AS DOING THIS AS A FULL-TIME JOB, IT'S A FULL-TIME JOB.

IF YOU WANT BETTER VALUE, THAT WOULD BE ONE OF THE THINGS YOU SHOULD LOOK AT IS TO MAKE IT A FULL-TIME JOB.

BUT THEN THAT WOULD KNOCK OUT PEOPLE HE WOULD WANT TO HAVE ANOTHER CAREER BUT ALSO SERVE AND YOU HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT A COUNTY COMMISSIONER OUGHT TO LOOK LIKE.

>> ANOTHER QUESTION. I GUESS A NUMBER OF DISCUSSIONS ABOUT COMPETITION AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.

THIS QUESTION KIND OF GOES TO THE BODY HERE.

HAS THERE BEEN ANY ISSUES WITH A LACK OF DECISION-MAKING OR IS THIS JUST KIND OF, I GUESS, EXERCISING HOW CAN BE BETTER SERVED THE CONSTITUENTS? AND SOLUTIONS HAS NOTHING BUT WITH NECESSARILY THE NUMBER BECAUSE AS WE GROW SUPPORTS AND ALSO MAKES A BIG DIFFERENCE FROM AN ORGANIZATIONAL STANDPOINT. SO HAS THERE BEEN ANY TYPE OF I GUESS A DECLINE OR LACK OF DECISION-MAKING EFFECTIVENESS EXISTING COMMISSIONERS? THIS IS WITH HISTORY AND

KNOWLEDGE OF COMMUNITY. >> I DON'T THINK SO.

I HAVE BEEN WATCHING COUNTY COMMISSION MEETINGS FOR DECADES. WHAT ISN'T ON ANY OF THESE PAPERS AS WE WENT FROM BEING I GUESS YOU WOULD CALL IT AT-LARGE SERVED EVERYBODY. THERE'S NEVER ANY PROBLEM DECISION-MAKING. IN MY OPINION THERE'S BEEN A PROBLEM TODAY A NEW COMMISSIONER, IF YOU ARE WAY OUT IN KEYSTONE HEIGHTS, YOU DON'T HAVE A WORKING KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT'S GOING ON IN MY LITTLE PART OF THE WORLD OFF KINGSLEY AVENUE AND I DON'T KNOW EITHER. WE ARE A BROAD COUNTY AND SOMETIMES THE KNOWLEDGE BASE ISN'T AS BROAD AS I WOULD LIKE TO SEE WITH A SINGLE MEMBER COMMISSION BUT DECISION-MAKING I'VE NEVER SEEN THEM UNABLE TO MAKE A DECISION.

I WAS THAT THEY HAD WORKING KNOWLEDGE TO MAKE THE BEST DECISION WHEN IT'S A SINGULAR ITEM ANYMORE JURISDICTIONAL AND

MANNER. >> I DON'T THINK WE'VE EVER HAD A PROBLEM MAKING A DECISION. IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA, YOU CAN'T VOTE PRESENT ON ANY ISSUE.

YOU'VE GOT TO VOTE UP OR DOWN. I DON'T THINK WE'VE EVER HAD A PROBLEM WITH THAT. WOULD JUST HESITATE TO SAY THAT WE HAVE THE SAME NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN WASHINGTON THAT WE'VE HAD SINCE THE BEGINNING OF THE COUNTRY AND WE DRAMATICALLY

[00:35:07]

I'M GLAD WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS BECAUSE I HAVE SOME THINGS THAT I THINK WILL CHANGE YOUR MIND ON THAT.

>> WE WILL COME TO THAT NEXT. I JUST WANT TO TAKE THIS.

DO WE HAVE ANY MORE COMMENTS ON KEEPING IT AT FIVE OR

INCREASING? >> IDEA.

I WILL GO FIRST AND THEN THE CHAIR CAN RECOGNIZE YOU, SIR.

I JUST THINK AS MR. CELLA JUST MENTIONED, THE CHALLENGE FOR US IS TO MAINTAIN A SMALL GOVERNMENT.

I THINK PART OF THE APPEAL AND THE ROMANCE AND THE INTIMACY OF CLAY COUNTY AS I KNOW FOR OUT OF MY FIVE COMMISSIONERS BY HANDSHAKE AND NAME. I THINK IT'S KIND OF COOL THAT WE CAN SEE SOMEONE AT PUBLIX OR WHEREVER WE SHOP OR OUT AND ABOUT IN THE COMMUNITY AND RECOGNIZE OUR COMMISSIONERS.

TO BE ON THE COMMISSIONER'S SIDE AND BE PRIVY TO WIN IS MY GARBAGE GOING TO BE PICKED UP IN THOSE KINDS OF QUESTIONS, I'M SURE THEY WOULD LIKE TO BE BEHIND THE COVER, SO TO SPEAK, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S A BIG MYSTERY WHAT THIS JOB ENTAILS.

WHEN YOU DECIDE YOU'RE GOING TO SERVE YOUR COMMUNITY I THINK IT'S PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD WE ARE BRINGING PEOPLE FORWARD THAT HAVE A FOREKNOWLEDGE OF WHAT THAT MEANS.

I WOULD JUST CHALLENGE US THAT OUR FEDERAL REPRESENTATIVE SERVES ABOUT 750,000 PEOPLE IN THIS DISTRICT OR HER DISTRICT OR WHOEVER IT IS. AND SO YES, THERE'S MORE STUFF.

THERE'S PROBABLY THREE OFFICES THAT SUPPORT EACH OF THEIR CONGRESSMEN. BUT 750,000 PEOPLE IS A FAR CRY FROM 40,000 PEOPLE. I KNOW IT'S NOT QUITE APPLES TO APPLES BUT THERE'S SOME MORE INTIMACY INVOLVED AND I'M A BIG FAN OF THREES, FIVES, AND SEVENS.

MAYBE IT'S A DESIGN BACKGROUND I WAS PART OF.

BUT FIVE SEEMS TO WORK. I THINK WE JUST GET TO A POINT OF INDECISIVENESS, THE AT-LARGE PEOPLE I DON'T THINK ARE FAIRLY REPRESENTATIVE OF THE CONSTITUENCY.

I RATHER BE ABLE TO KNOW THAT MR. CELLA OR WHOMEVER IS MY COMMISSIONER IS THE PERSON I'M GOING TO CALL IF I HAVE A PROBLEM OR IF I WANT TO PRAISE HIM THAT DAY, FOR EXAMPLE.

I JUST THINK FIVE IS A SYMPTOM NUMBER TO MAINTAIN SMALL GOVERNMENT AND ITS PART OF THE INTIMACY AND APPEAL OF CLAY

COUNTY. >> (INDISCERNIBLE).

>> WE HAVE A COUNTY MANAGER AND WITH THE -- IF YOU HAD A STRONG MAYOR I SUSPECT MAYBE, BUT THE JOB WOULD BE LESS INFLUENTIAL, MAYBE. I WAS ON THE SCHOOL BOARD FOR A WHILE IN THERE THEY HAD AN ELECTED SUPERINTENDENT AND AN ELECTED SCHOOL BOARD. AND THE SCHOOL BOARD WAS TASKED WITH DOING LEGISLATIVE TYPE OF THINGS AND DOING A BUDGET AND THE SUPERINTENDENT WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR ACTUALLY RUNNING EVERYTHING. BUT THE SUPERINTENDENT ENOUGH TO LISTEN AT THE SCHOOL BOARD AT ALL.

HE DID WHATEVER HE WANTED TO. SO I KIND OF LIKE THE CONCEPT OF A -- TICKET TO MAKE THE POLICY IF WE FEEL SOMETHING NEEDS TO BE DONE. I LIKE THE IDEA OF ROTATING THE

[00:40:12]

THE ARGUMENT FOR THE MAYOR'S CONSISTENT LEADERSHIP WHEN WE GO INTO ONE DIRECTION. THAT WORKS IF IT'S THE RIGHT DIRECTION. I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE THE DETENT WHERE THE BEST PLACE TO GO IS.

BUT THE WAY WE DO IT NOW IS WORKING PRETTY WELL, ACTUALLY.

WE GET A MIX OF IDEAS AND IT'S MORE COLLABORATIVE.

>> I'M GOING TO TRY TO REPEAT WHAT CHRIS WHISPERED IN MY EAR.

THE SUPERVISOR OF ELECTIONS WHISPERS INTO YOUR EAR, YOU LISTEN. BUT HE INDICATED THAT THE STATE REQUIRES YOU, IS THAT CORRECT --

>> THEY HAVE TO MAKE A SELECTION (INDISCERNIBLE)

(INDISCERNIBLE). >> I CAN ONLY TELL YOU BECAUSE I SPOKE TO THE COMMITTEE FOUR YEARS AGO WHEN THERE WAS SOMEBODY CHANGING OUR FORM OF GOVERNMENT, THE COUNTY MANAGER FORM OF GOVERNMENT IS THE MOST POPULAR IN THE COUNTRY.

IT'S OVER 3500 DIFFERENT MUNICIPALITIES OR COUNTIES THINK OF US ON THE BCC AND THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS IN THE COUNTY MANAGERS OUR CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER RESPONSIBLE FOR IN THE DAY-TO-DAY OPERATIONS OF THE CORPORATION WORK. AND SO THAT IS USUALLY A PROFESSIONAL AND SOMEBODY WORKS DIRECTLY FOR THE BOARD AND SO THOSE THINGS ARE NOT GETTING DONE, THE BOARD HAS THE RESPONSIBILITY OF MAKING A CHANGE.

IF YOU ARE A MAYOR, AS WE SEEN EMILY -- IF YOU HAVE A MAYOR THAT'S NOT DOING THE JOB, THEY STAY UNTIL THE CONSTITUENTS DECIDE IN AN ELECTION IN FOUR YEARS THAT THEY ARE NOT DOING THE JOB. SO THERE IS LITTLE BIT OF A DIFFERENT FORM -- A THOUGHT PROCESS THERE.

MUCH MORE POLITICAL BECAUSE THE MAYOR WOULD BE POLITICAL IN TERMS OF RUNNING AGAIN FOR REELECTION AS OPPOSED TO A COUNTY MANAGER WHO IS A PROFESSIONAL AND THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR MAKING SURE THE COUNTY RECOVERS PUT FORTH BY THE BCC IS PUT FORTH RELY THINK IN TERMS OF COUNTY MANAGER IS ONE OF THE MOST POPULAR FORMS IN THE COUNTRY IN WHICH I LOOKED IT UP AGAIN BUT HE DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT MY NOTES TO TELL YOU HOW MANY IT IS BUT THAT'S WHY THAT WAS DECIDED. THAT WAS DECIDED BY OUR FOREFATHERS WHEN THEY HAD TO MAKE THAT DECISION.

AS I TOLD THE GROUP THE LAST TIME, UNLESS THERE'S A NEIGHBOR HANGING OVER THE FENCE TELLING YOU THAT THEY HAVE A BUNCH OF GREAT REASONS WHY WE SHOULD CHANGE AND DECIDE TO ELECT A MAYOR INSTEAD OF HIRE A COUNTY MANAGER THAN WE ARE GOING IN

THE RIGHT DIRECTION, I THINK. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THAT?

>> WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DO IS MY EXCEPTION UNLESS THERE IS A MOTION TO MOVE TO A GREATER NUMBER THAN FIVE WE WILL LEAVE IT AT FIVE AND MOVE ON TO THE NEXT TOPIC.

OKAY. IN THE SECOND PART OF THIS IS SHOULD WE KEEP IT TO DISTRICT ONLY OR SHOULD WE LOOK AT CHANGING THE COMPOSITION TO, SAY, THREE DISTRICT AND TO ADD-LARGE? I WOULD LIKE TO OPEN THAT UP

FOR DISCUSSION TOO. >> WHAT WOULD BE THE BENEFIT OF REDUCING 5 TO 3 WITH TWO AT-LARGE?

>> I WOULD LIKE TO OPEN THAT UP FOR OPINIONS AS WELL AS --

THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. >> IS THERE A BENEFIT TO THAT.

>> A BENEFIT TO DOING THE TWO AT-LARGE AND THREE DISTRICT?

[00:45:03]

I LOOK AT MY CONSTITUENTS FIRST AND THEN I PULL BACK TO TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE WHOLE GALLERY.

OBVIOUSLY, WHEN I GO TO AN HOA MEETING AND THAT'S HOW I RUN MY BUSINESS, I GO TO AS MANY AS I CAN IN MY DISTRICT AND I TELL THOSE PEOPLE I'M YOUR GUY. I WORK ONLY FOR YOU AND I AM THE ONLY GUY YOU CAN TOO VOTE FOR.

AND IF YOU DON'T LIKE WHAT I DO, I'M GONE.

AND I THINK THAT CONCEPT WORKS VERY WELL IN MY MIND.

I KNOW MY DISTRICT PRETTY WELL AND I KNOW IT'S IMPORTANT TO MY PEOPLE AS I KNOCKED ON 4000 DOORS TO GET ELECTED.

I LISTENED TO EVERY ONE OF THEM AND I GET A GOOD PULSE OVER THEY ARE COMING FROM. THESE ARE NECESSARILY THE SAME ISSUES. I'VE GOT TO KEEP THAT IN MIND.

IF MY PEOPLE FEEL VERY STRONGLY, I VOTE.

IT'S A REPRESENTATIVE AND I DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING.

YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL. THEY ARE ABOUT THE SAME THING.

THERE IS AN ORGANIZED THING GOING ON.

ANYWAY, I TRIED TO DO THIS AND LOOK AT MY CONSTITUENCY AND SAY WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE WHOLE COUNTY.

AT THE END OF THE DAY WE ARE ALL TOGETHER WITH THIS.

WHEN I LOOK AT SOME OF THESE THINGS, A PARK IN A PARTICULAR AREA, I SAY WILL MY CONSTITUENTS BE WILLING TO PAY FOR THE PARK AT KEYSTONE AND MIDDLEBURG? THERE'S A LOT OF GIVE AND TAKE AND THAT'S THE KIND OF THING YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT. SO I FEEL IT'S GOOD THE WAY IT IS. THE SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICT IT MAKES YOU REALLY RESPONSIVE TO THE PEOPLE THAT VOTED YOU IN.

IT'S THE SAME WAY THAT THE NATIONAL GOVERNMENT WORKS.

EVERYBODY HAS THEIR OWN CONSTITUENCY SO THEY ARE KEEPING AN EYE ON THAT AS WELL. SO THAT'S HOW THAT WORKS.

I THINK IT MAKES CAMPAIGNING EASIER BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT MY PEOPLE THINK AND I TRY AND REPRESENT THAT TO THE REST OF THE COUNTY. BUT AS FAR AS IS IT GOING TO IMPROVE THE OVERALL BENEFIT OF THE COUNTY, I DON'T SEE THAT HAPPENING THAT MUCH. DOES IT MAKE IT EASIER FOR THE REALISTIC LOOK TO INFLUENCE THE COMMISSIONER'S DECISIONS WHEN THINGS ARE GOING ON DOWN IN LAKE ASBURY? AND I GOT EVERYBODY AND THEIR BROTHER TRYING TO INFLUENCE ME.

THIS IS A GOOD IDEA OR THAT IS A BAD IDEA? I LOOK AT MY OWN STUFF FIRST AND I DON'T HAVE TO LISTEN TO THOSE GUYS IF I DON'T WANT TO. EVEN IF THEY DONATE MONEY ON MY CAMPAIGN, I DO WHAT'S RIGHT FOR PEOPLE.

WHEN YOU OPEN IT UP FOR THE COUNTY IT CHANGES THE DYNAMIC OF WHAT A COMMISSIONER IS THINKING ABOUT.

I CAUTION YOU ON THAT. >> COMMISSIONER SELLA?

THOUGHTS? >> LET'S TAKE A TRIP BACK TO MEMORY LANE A LITTLE BIT. BACK IN 2006-2008 TIMEFRAME AND CHRIS CAN PROBABLY CORRECT ME ON THE TIMEFRAME AND THEY PETITIONED TO GO FROM AT-LARGE REPRESENTATION ON THE BCC TO SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS I ALSO WENT WITH TERM LIMITS AND THEY COMMISSIONER PAIN. IT WAS ALL PRETTY MUCH ABOUT THE SAME TIME. THE SAME PEOPLE THAT GENERATED THAT PETITION. HE PRESENTED IT TO SUPERVISOR ELECTION AND IT WAS ON THE BALLOT AND IT PASSED BY THE RESIDENTS IN THE TAXPAYERS AND VOTERS OF LAKE COUNTY.

PART OF THAT WAS BECAUSE THE RACE WAS VERY CLOSE BACK IN 2004/2008/ AND ONE CANDIDATE ONE QUITE DRAMATICALLY THEIR OWN DISTRICT BY A 2-1 VOTE AND LOST THE OTHER DISTRICTS AND SO THEY ENDED UP LOSING THE ELECTION BY 125 VOTES.

SO THE SUPPORTERS WERE UNHAPPY THAT THE PERSON THEY WANTED TO SERVE AS COMMISSIONER FOR THAT DISTRICT LOST.

QUITE HONESTLY HE WON HIS HOME DISTRICT, DISTRICT ONE BY -

[00:50:06]

THAT WOULDN'T WORK BECAUSE WE HAVE FIVE DISTRICTS.

BY CHARTER WE HAVE TO HAVE FIVE DISTRICTS.

YOU HAVE TO DO THAT BEFORE YOU CAN CHANGE REPRESENTATION AND YOU HAVE TO GO TO THREE DISTRICT SO YOU HAVE COMMISSIONER REPRESENTING EACH DISTRICT AND TO ADD-LARGE. THE COMMISSIONER WAS TALKING ABOUT CHANGES THE THOUGHT PROCESS BY THE COMMISSIONER BECAUSE QUITE HONESTLY, I KNOW MY DISTRICT WHEN HE NOTICES DISTRICT LIKE THE BACK OF MY HAND.

YOU CAN TELL YOU WHERE POTHOLES SHOW UP AND DISTRICT YOU AND I CAN SHOW YOU WHERE THEY SHOW UP IN DISTRICT 1 EVEN WITHOUT DRIVING THE ROADS BECAUSE THAT'S MY AREA RATHER THAN HAVING 700 SQUARE MILES TO LOOK AT I HAVE MY DISTRICT.

SO A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT THINGS ABOUT THAT.

SO YOU CAN PAY ATTENTION TO YOUR OWN DISTRICT YOU'RE MORE IN TUNE WITH WHAT'S HAPPENING THERE I CAN MAKE MORE HOA MEETINGS AND CDE MEETINGS IN MY DISTRICT AND IF I WAS AT-LARGE AND I WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR GOING TO ALL OF THOSE HOA'S AND CDD'S. I'M COUNTING ON HIM GOING TO ONCE THAT HE NEEDS TO SO HE CAN BRING US PROBLEMS FROM HIS DISTRICT AND JIM FROM DISTRICT 3 IS GOING TO HIS MEETING SO HE CAN BRING THOSE PROBLEMS TO ME. WE WILL DEFER TO THE COMMISSION FROM THAT PARTICULAR DISTRICT BECAUSE THEY KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING THERE AND THEY KNOW IT'S BETTER I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT DURING CAMPAIGNS, THAT IT CHANGES THE NATURE OF THE CAMPAIGN. IF YOU ARE RUNNING A FULL DISTRICT RACE, YOU HAVE TWO CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS YOU HAVE TO DO THAT. IT'S CONSIDERABLY MORE ARDUOUS AND MORE EXPENSIVE TO DO THAT AND JUST DOING ONE SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICT. IF I HAD TO CAMPAIGN IN IRAN ORIGINALLY IN MORE THAN ONE DISTRICT AND HAD TO DO IT ALL THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY, IT WOULD'VE BEEN VERY DIFFICULT, IF NOT IMPOSSIBLE, RUNNING A BUSINESS OF MY OWN AND THEN TRYING TO RUN. RIGHT THEN AND THERE YOU ARE ATTRACTING A CERTAIN TYPE OF CANDIDATE.

IT ALSO TAKES MORE MONEY. SO THOSE CANDIDATES EITHER ARE GOING TO BE VERY WELL FINANCED BY SPECIAL INTERESTS OR EVEN THEIR OWN MONIES TO BE ELECTED IF THEY RUN ON A FULL COUNTY BASIS. IN THE OTHER THING IS THIS IS FUNNY AND MITCH IS THERE AND WE TALKED TO ONE OF HIS COLLEAGUES NOT TOO LONG AGO ABOUT THIS BUT HE SAID TRYING TO REVIEW IN GERMAN THAT I HAVE TO GO BACK. I SAID IF WE DON'T AT-LARGE AND I'M A COMMISSIONER AND LARGE EVEN I'M SUPPOSED TO BE REPRESENTING DISTRICT ONE WHERE DO YOU THINK I WILL HANG OUT IN TERMS OF GETTING REELECTED. FILLING OUT AN OAKLEAF AND -- IN THE SENSE THAT I HEAR A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY I DON'T GET TO VOTE FOR ALL OF THE PEOPLE ON THE CONGRESSIONAL SIDE OR THE HOUSE OR THE STATE SENATE. SOMETHING SIMILAR TO WHAT WE ARE THINKING AND I THINK IT'S JUST EVERYBODY IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR SPECIFIC DISTRICT AND THEY COMBINED WITH OTHER LEGISLATORS OR CONGRESSMEN OR WHATEVER THE CASE MAY BE TOO ACT YOU'RE STILL RUNNING YOUR BUSINESS YOU ARE STILL

OPERATING IN A JOB. >> I HAD A THE AVERAGE COST AS A REPRESENTATIVE WHAT WOULD YOU SAY THAT IS?

>> HOW MANY OF YOU ACTUALLY RAN FOR OFFICE?UITE A FEW OF YOU. SO I SPENT -- THE NUMBER I'M LOOKING AT WAS ABOUT $30,000 30 TO 50 AND IF YOU ARE A REGULAR

[00:55:07]

YOU CAN SPEND MORE. I'VE SEEN PEOPLE SPEND $107,000 TRYING TO GET ELECTED TO THE SCHOOL BOARD AND GLUES AND IT'S REALLY ABOUT NAME RECOGNITION IF YOU ARE WILLING TO GET OUT AMONG THE PEOPLE I TELL PEOPLE IT'S KIND OF SILLY.

YOU'RE GOING TO SPEND $30,000 AFTER TAXES TO MAKE $38,000 BEFORE TAXES TO GET THIS JOB. SO YOU HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT

TOO. >> I THINK THE NUMBERS HE USED ARE PRETTY MUCH ACCURATE. I THINK I SPENT $44,000 GOT ALL OF MY MONEY. CONTRIBUTIONS FOR SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICT AND I DIDN'T RUN AN EXTRAVAGANT RACE.

AND THEN THE SIGNS IN THESE DAYS WITH THE WAY I WAS TALKING TO SCOTTY TAYLOR ABOUT THIS AND THE WAY THE COST OF LUMBER IS USED TO BE A TWO BY FOUR TO HOLD OF YOUR SIGNS IS NOW NINE OR $10 AND IF YOU PUT OUT 100 SIGNS YOU CAN IMAGINE WHERE THE MONEY GOES. IN THE OTHER PROBLEM HERE IN CLAY COUNTY IS WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF MEDIA.

WE HAVE CLAY TODAY NEIGHBOR TO NEIGHBOR AND THEN AFTER THAT, WE DON'T HAVE ANY ELECTRONIC MEDIA.

I HAVEN'T TALKED TO ANYBODY THAT'S BEEN SUCCESSFUL YOU HASN'T WALKED I THINK THAT RETAIL IS ALIVE.

JUST RAN OUT OF TIME OTHERWISE I WOULD HAVE DONE MORE.

I WOULD SAY YOU ARE LOOKING AT 3250 FIGURES.

IF YOU WENT BIGGER, A LOOK AT ST. JOHNS COUNTY.

FIVE COMMISSIONERS. MY OLD BOSS RAN AND HE RAISED OVER 150,000 IN THE NEXT THREE CANDIDATES THAT WAS IN ST.

JOHNS COUNTY. NOT THAT I THINK YOU CAN EVEN SPEND THAT MONEY. YOU HAVE TO COVER ALL 740 SQUARE MILES WHATEVER MILEAGE THAT WE HAD TO GO THAT ASIDE I'VE BEEN HERE WHEN IT WAS YOU RAN THE WHOLE COUNTY.

WOULD BE IF YOU GET A REAL STINKER FOR A COUNTY COMMISSIONER HE WAS UNRESPONSIVE AND I'VE HAD A

[01:00:02]

I DECIDED IT WAS OUT OF MY DISTRICT I CALLED MIKE AND HE CALL ME BACK. IT WAS THE TRUTH AND HOW IT HAD TO BE. SOME OF IT IS PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY BUT I THINK SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS IS THE WAY TO GO BECAUSE I DO THINK WE ARE A VERY DIVERSE COUNTY IN SIZE AND SPACE AND IN PHYSICAL LAYOUT.

I THINK IT'S THE WAY TO GO AND I WAS A DIEHARD COUNTYWIDE BUT I STILL DON'T THINK IT SHOULD BE EASY.

>> I'M GOING TO BE REPETITIVE. THE THING THAT BOTHERS ME ABOUT AT-LARGE IS WE TURN THE COUNTY INTO WHERE THE POPULATION IS.

THAT'S WHAT THEY ARE GOING TO CARE ABOUT.

YOU WILL GO TO OAKLEY AND FLEMING ISLAND.

THE PERSON THAT REPRESENTS KEYSTONE HEIGHTS IS THE PERSON THAT REPRESENTS OAKLEAF. I KNOW WHEN MY TERM, WHEN WE HAD ISSUES THAT WE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT WE WENT TO ALL FIVE OF THE COMMISSIONERS AND TALKED IT OUT.

I DIDN'T GO TO JUST MIKE. I WENT TO MY FIRST BUT WE WENT TO EVERY COMMISSIONER. THAT'S WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO.

THAT WAY THEY GET BETTER COVERAGE AND WE GET A CLOSER GOVERNMENT TO THE PEOPLE AND IF WE HAVE THE PEOPLE IN KEYSTONE BEING DOMINATED. THEY ARE VERY DIFFERENT.

THANK YOU. >> KEEP IN MIND WHEN YOU GO BACK TO THE THREE SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS IN THE TWO AT-LARGE, WE JUST GOT THROUGH DOING REDISTRICTING.

SO TO KEEP THE EQUAL NUMBERS OF FIVE DISTRICTS, SO IF YOU -- IF THE VOTERS DECIDED TO GO WITH THREE SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS AND TWO AT-LARGE IT HAD TO BE SOME KIND OF CONFIGURATION OF THE DISTRICTS AGAIN. SO I WOULD KEEP THAT IN MIND.

>> (INDISCERNIBLE). >> GRAND WISER IS PROBABLY THE LARGEST NOT THAT SOMEBODY WILL ALSO ALWAYS LIVE IN KEYSTONE HEIGHTS THE AMOUNT OF DRIVETIME FROM THAT POINT THAT'S NOT INCLUDING THE OTHER THINGS THAT THEY HAVE TO DO THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY AND COMING UP FOR MEETINGS AND SUCH.

>> MY INPUT WOULD BE WITH THE SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS WE HAVE THAT AND WE HAVE THE FAITH IN OUR COUNTY COMMISSIONER BOARD AS A BOARD AND IF IT BECAME THE COUNTY AT-LARGE OR THE COUNTY ITSELF WE WOULD PUT THE FAITH INTO OUR INDIVIDUAL REPRESENTATIVES TO BE ABLE TO COME TOGETHER AND LOOK AT THE ISSUES FOR THE COUNTY AS A WHOLE RATHER THAN OUR INDIVIDUAL DISTRICTS. THEY ARE ADVOCATING FOR THEIR INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE BUT WE HAVE TO KNOW THAT THE COUNTY DICTATED THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS WILL GO COME TOGETHER IF IT'S A COUNTY WIDE ISSUE THEY WOULD DECIDE IN THE

BEST INTEREST RATHER THAN HAVE. >> WITH THE SIZE OF THE COUNTY

(INDISCERNIBLE). >> I DON'T THINK THE COMMISSIONERS COULD EFFECTIVELY WORK FOR THEIR DISTRICTS IF WE WENT THE THREE DISTRICTS, SO I THINK TO DO AT-LARGE YOU WOULD HAVE TO HAVE FIVE DISTRICTS AND THEN TO ADD-LARGE AND I THINK

THAT'S TOO MANY. >> THANK YOU.

ANY OTHERS? JUST LIKE THE FIRST ITEM BY CONSENSUS, WE WON'T -- SINCE THERE'S NO MOTION TO CHANGE IT WE WILL LEAVE IT AS IT IS. THE NEXT ONE IS TERM LIMITS.

[01:05:19]

YOU CAN KEEP IT THE TWO CONSECUTIVE AND YOU CAN INCREASE THE NUMBER OF TERM LIMITS AT THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO RECOMMEND. YOU CAN DECREASE FROM TO AND ONE AND ALSO THE QUESTION IS THE LIMIT OF THE NUMBER OF TERMS IN TOTAL. SO SOMEONE, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, CAN RUN TODAY, SERVE TWO TERMS IN A COUPLE OF YEARS LATER COME BACK AND RUN AND SUCCESSFULLY SERVE ANOTHER TWO TERMS. THOSE ARE THE OPTIONS AS I UNDERSTAND IT. THE QUESTION FOR THE BOARD IS SHOULD WE CHANGE IT? AND IF YOU -- WE WILL START WITH OUR COMMISSIONERS AND GO FROM THERE.

>> I AM AN EXAMPLE OF TERM LIMITS.

THIS IS MY LAST YEAR AND I FINALLY GOT THE HANG OF THIS THING PRETTY WELL. NOW I'M GOING TO HAVE TO MOVE ON. I AM AGAINST TERM LIMITS TO TELL YOU WHERE I'M COMING FROM. I THINK THE VOTERS GET A SHOT AT US AND I THINK THAT'S A GOOD THING.

AND THAT'S THE WAY IT OUGHT TO WORK.

I WAS ONE OF THE DISSENTERS ON THE TERM LIMITS FOR THE CONSTITUTIONALIST. THOSE GUYS ARE EXECUTIVES WORKING AND RUNNING A WHOLE DEPARTMENT AFTER SO MANY YEARS OF WORKING FOR YOU EVEN THOUGH HE IS DOING A GOOD JOB, YOU HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT. YOU CAN'T JUST SIT DOWN IN THE CHAIR AND BE THE SUPERVISOR OF ELECTIONS IN A TWO WEEK PERIOD.

IT DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY. I WOULD SAY THAT I WOULD REALLY BE AGAINST TERM LIMITS FOR CONSTITUTIONALIST AND THAT'S WHY I THINK THEY DID A THREE TERM LIMIT FOR THEM.

THE LEGISLATIVE FOLKS LIKE MYSELF, I CAN LIVE WITH TWO TERMS. I UNDERSTAND THE REASON FOR THAT. ONCE YOU GET GOOD AT BEING ELECTED, IT'S PRETTY TOUGH GETTING THE GUY OUT IF YOU FEEL LIKE HE IS NOT DOING THE JOB. HE FLIPSIDE TO THAT, NOBODY REALIZES THAT, BUT FOR THE LAST FOUR YEARS, WE'VE HAD THREE COMMISSIONERS WHO TURNED OUT WERE LAME DUCKS.

IT WAS GAVIN AND HUTCHINS AND MYSELF.

WE COULD HAVE RAISED TAXES TO THE MOON AND NOBODY CAN DO ANYTHING TO US BECAUSE WE WERE TURNED OUT IN A COUPLE OF YEARS. AND WE TOTALLY DON'T HAVE TO BE RESPONSIBLE AND THAT'S ONE SIDE EFFECT OF TERM LIMITS NOBODY REALLY TALKS ABOUT. I AM FOR JUST LETTING EVERYBODY GET ELECTED WHEN THEY GET ELECTED.

AS FAR AS COMING BACK, I THINK THAT'S OKAY.

IF SOMEBODY ELSE GETS ELECTED IN THAT OFFICE AND THEY ARE NOT DOING THE JOB AND THEN YOU WANT TO RUN AGAIN FOR ANOTHER TWO

TERMS, AND YOU GET ELECTED. >> THANK YOU.

AS WE PART COMPANY HERE, LET'S TALK ABOUT TERM LIMITS.

THE VOTERS MAKING IT A THREE TERM POSITION LIFETIME.

YOU COULD NOT SERVE YOUR TWO TERMS AND HAVE A TERM OFTEN COME BACK AND SERVED TWO TERMS AND HAVE A TERM OFTEN COME BACK AND SERVE TWO MORE TERMS. LORD KNOWS WHY ANYONE WOULD WANT TO DO THAT. I THINK EIGHT YEARS IS PRETTY TOUGH TO GET THROUGH AS IT IS, NEVER MIND DOING IT OVER AND OVER AGAIN. YOU WOULD HAVE TO START PRETTY YOUNG. THAT WAS THE BATTLE FOUR YEARS AGO AND I THINK IT WAS EITHER 56 OR 58 PERCENT AGAINST AND ALSO IS WHEN THE THREE TERM LIMIT FOR THE CONSTITUTIONALIST WAS INPUT BY OUR BOARD AND THAT WAS VOTED AND APPROVED BY THE

[01:10:07]

YOU CAN SAY THEY LEAVE IT TO THE VOTERS BUT THE VOTERS HAVE NOT BEEN EXACTLY AS A GROUP DOING WHAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO DO. SO YOU COULD ARGUE THAT OUR BOARD WOULD LOOK ENTIRELY DIFFERENT TODAY WE DID NOT HAVE TERM LIMITS. I THINK HE WOULD AGREE WITH THAT. WE MAY NOT HAVE THE COMPOSITION OF THE BOARD WE HAVE CURRENTLY AND IT MAY NOT LOOK LIKE IT WOULD BE IF WE HAD TERM LIMITS ARE NO TERM LIMITS GOING FORWARD FROM GOING HERE.O I'M IN FAVOR OF TERM LIMITS AND THERE'S BEEN A LOT MADE BETWEEN ARGUMENTS ABOUT THE CONSTITUTIONALIST AND HOW THEY ARE PROFESSIONALS AND THEY TAKE CARE RUNNING AN OPERATION AND WE ARE JUST LEGISLATIVE GUYS AND COMMISSIONERS AND WE DON'T DO TOO MUCH.

WE ARE RUNNING A $380 MILLION CORPORATION.

AS I SAID BEFORE, WE ARE THE BOARD AND WE HIRE A CEO ONLY MAKE DETERMINATIONS BASED ON A BIG INVESTMENT BY CLAY COUNTY TAXPAYERS. AND SO CONSEQUENTLY I DON'T BUY THAT THAT WE ARE JUST LEGISLATIVE GUYS AND ANYBODY CAN SET THERE. WE WILL ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING N LIFE BEFORE WE GOT TO BE BORDERLINE TO OFFICE.

YOU DON'T STEP OFF THE TURNIP FARM AND GET ON THE BALLOT IN THE ELECTED THAT'S ALL I HAVE. THANKS.

>> (INDISCERNIBLE). >> IS WHAT MAKES THE POSITION OF THOSE OFFICES MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE TO BE IN A CEO POSITION THAT YOU CANNOT GET IT ACCOMPLISHED IN THE TIME PERIOD OF TWO TERMS? VERSUS THREE.

>> IS NOT A QUESTION FOR ME? >> I CERTAINLY CAN'T EVEN BEGIN TO WHAT THE GOVERNOR DOES OR DOES NOT DO WHAT I CAN TELL YOU WITH 13 STAFF MEMBERS AND WITH SIX YEARS THAT IT TAKES TO BECOME CERTIFIED AS SUPERVISOR OF ELECTIONS IS THE DIFFERENCE.

AS FAR AS THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH, WE ARE BOTH MEMBERS OF THE EXECUTIVE. AND I CERTAINLY DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY DIFFERENCE THERE. AS FAR AS LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND TERM LIMITS, I DON'T THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA.

I THINK THAT IT CREATES A LOT OF THINGS.

THAT CAME AFTER THE COURT CASE THAT WAS PUT IN PLACE MANY YEARS AGO. AND I THINK IF YOU WERE GOING

[01:15:05]

BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS TONIGHT. >> OKAY.

>> ON THE KEEP IT JUST TO THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS AND TERM LIMITS. DOES THIS POSSIBILITY EXISTS

FOR THE COMMISSIONER? >> THEY ARE SET AT THE SAME

TIME. >> WITH THAT I WOULD LIKE TO

OPEN IT UP AGAIN TO THE BOARD. >>.

>> I'M IN FAVOR OF. COULD HE TURN OUT AND RUN THEIRS? THE PROBLEM WITH COUNTY AND CITY GOVERNMENT IS WE LOOK AT PROBLEMS AGO IN WASHINGTON I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S AN ISSUE IN CLAY COUNTY BUT WE TEND TO REACT THAT WAY WHEN IT CAME TIME TO VOTE ON TERM LIMITS.

TERM LIMITS ARE THERE AND I THINK THE VOTERS SPOKE LAST TIME ABOUT ONE OF THE FREE TERMS. AND THEY DID NOT LIKE THE IDEA. SO I THINK THIS GROUP NEEDS TO SIT BACK AND SAY NOT JUST WHAT DO YOU THINK IS APPROPRIATE BUT WHAT DO YOU THINK THE VOTERS WILL SAY.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO BRING IN ON THAT I THINK THERE WAS A LOT OF FRUSTRATION THERE WAS MORE FRUSTRATION FOR YEARS PRIOR TO THAT. THERE IS A RECALL THAT GIVES COUNTY OPTIONS TO GET RID OF THE WASTE OR TO CLEAN HOUSE WHEN IT NEEDS TO BE CLEANED. I HEARD SOMEONE MADE THE COMMENT SAYING WE HAVE DEADBEAT COMMISSIONERS.

I'M SURE THERE HAS BEEN QUITE A FEW.

AND I KNOW IN MY DISTRICT WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL THE DEADBEAT COMMISSIONER BECAUSE THAT INDIVIDUAL CLEARLY STATED NOBODY IN MY AREA VOTED FOR HIM.

WITH THAT BEING SAID, IT IS WHAT IT IS.

SO I THINK THE COUNTY IS CAPABLE OF CLEANING THEIR OWN HOUSE. AND TERM LIMITS MAY NOT BE THE

[01:20:07]

ANYTHING WHAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE WOULD BENEFIT THE VOTERS TO DO THAT. I THINK WE SHOULD LEAVE IT AFTER FOUR YEARS THEY CAN BE IN THERE ANOTHER TERM OR TWO.

I APOLOGIZE THAT I DIDN'T TAKE MY TIME.

I AM A STAUNCH BELIEVER THAT THE ELECTORATE IS THE ARBITER OF TERM LIMITS. WHAT I HAVE DISCOVERED IS HE COMMENTED TO THIS THAT WE ARE NOT AS ENLIGHTENED AS WE SHOULD BE. WE HAVE FAMILIES IS SOMETIMES NOT AFFORDED TO US. THEREFORE, WE NEED SOME SORT OF MECHANISM TO HELP THE VOTER WHICH PAINS ME TO SAY THAT BECAUSE I BELIEVE AS I TAKE RESPONSIBILITY IN MY VOTING CHOICES SO SHOULD OTHERS. MY WIFE WHO OFTEN IS MORE WISDOM THAN I AM CAME TO ME ONE DAY.

I SERVED AT MY CHURCH FOR THREE YEARS WHICH WAS THE TERM LIMIT BECAUSE THEY WANTED NEW BLOOD AND NEW IDEAS TO CIRCULATE.

WE DID NOT WANT FISH TO ROT LONGER THAN A THREE YEAR TERM BUT I ALSO DROVE A GOLF CART IN MY CHURCH FOR FIVE YEARS AND I DROVE THIS GOLF CART TO PICK UP ANYONE WHO NEEDED ASSISTANCE I LOVE THAT JOB FOR FIVE YEARS I DID IT AND MY WIFE CAME TO ME ONE DAY AND SAID ARE YOU EVER GOING TO LET THIS THING GO? AND I SAID NO. I LOVE IT.

PEOPLE LOVE TALKING TO ME AND I LOVE TALKING TO PEOPLE.

HER INFINITE WISDOM CAME TO ME AND SAID DO YOU THINK SOMEONE ELSE MIGHT WANT TO DO THE SAME JOB YOU'RE DOING AND YOU'RE BEING SELFISH NOT TO LET IT GO AND IT HIT ME IN THE GUT.

AND I SAID AS MUCH AS I'VE BEEN HONORED AND I HAVE GREAT THINGS HAVE COME FROM IT SOMEONE ELSE MAY WANT TO DO THE VERY SAME THING AND ARE NOT GETTING OUT OF THE WAY.

IT'S CHANGED MY MIND. SOMEONE ELSE WOULD LIKE TO SERVE IN THIS CAPACITY AND ME BEING BULLHEADED AND HOLDING DOWN THE FORT AND NOT LETTING THAT PERSON SERVED.

SO I BELIEVE AND TERM LIMITS. EIGHT YEARS IS LONG ENOUGH.

>> THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? SO DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO CHANGE TERM LIMITS? IF NOT WE WILL LEAVE IT AS IT IS.

>> DOES THE TERM HAVE TO STAY FOUR YEARS.

>> AND JUST THROWING IT OUT THERE.

SIX-YEAR TERM AND SOMEONE MENTIONED EIGHT YEARS EARLIER.

>> IF YOU HAD SIX-YEAR TERMS YOU WOULD HAVE (ROLL CALLED).

>> I'M JUST SAYING -- I JUST WANT TO BRING THAT UP BECAUSE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT LEAVING IT AS IS AND TALKING ABOUT TERMS AND TERM LIMITS AND WE ARE CUTTING THE CONVERSATION SHORT WITHOUT LOOKING AT THE WHOE PICTURE AN OLD PICTURE IS TERMS VERSUS TERM LIMITS TO KNOW THE TERM.

>> (INDISCERNIBLE). >> AND THEN WE TRY TO TURN AROUND AND SAY LET'S DO SIX-YEAR TERMS TIMES TWO.

I DON'T THINK THAT WILL GO OVER.

[01:25:09]

>> I'M JUST SAYING IF WE ARE GOING TO TALK TERMS AND TERM LIMITS LET'S TALK THE WHOLE CONVERSATION.

>> I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT THE PERIOD THAT VOTERS VOTED ON WAS A HEIRS AND WE WOULD BE REDEFINING THAT IN A DIFFERENT WAY. SO I AM OPPOSED TO THAT.

>> I JUST WANTED TO BRING IT UP FOR DISCUSSION.

>> DULY NOTED. >> I WOULD JUST LIKE TO SAY I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF TERM LIMITS BUT THE VOTERS DID VOTE ON THAT AND AGAIN TO SUSIE AND MITCH'S POINT WHAT DO WE THINK THE VOTERS WOULD DO? I THINK LEAVING THE SAME IS VERY COMFORTABLE AND IF HE'S GOT SOMEONE WHO'S REALLY GREAT WHO CAN COME BACK AFTER THE PERIOD OF BEING OFF, THAT'S TERRIFIC. THE VOTERS WANTED THEM BACK.

WE ARE SPECIFICALLY TALKING JUST ON THE COUNTY

COMMISSIONERS AT THIS POINT. >> CORRECT.

>> I WAS TAUGHT FROM AN EARLY AGE THAT MY BOAT WAS MY TERM LIMIT. HOWEVER, I WAS ALSO TAUGHT THE WILL OF THE VOTERS AND THE VOTERS CLEARLY SPOKE ABOUT TERM LIMITS AND I DON'T SEE ANYBODY OUT THERE CLEARLY SPEAKING AGAINST TERM LIMITS. I THINK TO EVERYBODY'S POINT, WE SHOULD LEAVE IT AS IS AND MOVE ON.

>> BY CONSENSUS, SINCE THERE'S NO MOTION, THAT'S WHAT WE WILL DO. THE NEXT ITEM WAS MINIMUM QUALIFICATIONS SO I'M OPENING THE FLOOR TO THAT BECAUSE -- UNLESS YOU HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE COMMISSIONERS, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT WAS BROUGHT UP AS A TOPIC INITIALLY HAD TO DO WITH RESIDENCY AS WELL AS AGE AND NUMBER OF YEARS LIVING IN THE COUNTY.

IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON NOT. WE DON'T GET A LOT OF TIME TO LIVE ANYWHERE AND IF A MILITARY MEMBER COMES IN MAYBE LIVES HERE IF YOU ARE A PAIR BUT HE HASN'T BEEN A RESIDENT FOR ENOUGH YEARS, WHY WOULD I DENY THEM OR THEIR SPOUSE OR ANYBODY IN THEIR FAMILY FROM SERVING I THINK -- BUT INAPPROPRIATE AT BEST MAYBE YOU HAVE NEW SPARK AND THAT NEW PASSION AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE OLD-TIMERS AND ASKED THOSE QUESTIONS WHY WOULDN'T YOU ASK SOMEONE WITH A FRESH OUTLOOK.

THAT'S A PERSONAL OPINION. I LOOK AT IT FROM A MILITARY STANDPOINT. WE DIDN'T LAND ANYWHERE FOR MORE THAN THREE YEARS FOREVER. IF I WANTED TO SERVE YOU WOULD DENY ME THAT MY FIRST YEAR AND MAYBE IT WAS A COUNTY COMMISSIONER FOR SIX YEARS BEFORE I WAS A MILITARY SPOUSE.

YOU'RE LOSING A REAL POOL IN THIS COMMUNITY.

IT JUST SOUNDS VERY INCESTUOUS. >> I'M GOING TO PARENT YOUR COMMENTS TO A DEGREE. WE HAVE SAID THE VOTERS HAVE THE SAY. SOMEBODY MADE A COMMENT WE WANT PEOPLE MOVING INTO THE COUNTY TO BE HERE FOR FIVE YEARS BEFORE THEY COULD RUN SO THEY UNDERSTAND HOW WE DO THINGS.

I DON'T THINK THAT'S THE BEST IDEA.

IF SOMEBODY IS OLD ENOUGH TO SERVE IN THE MILITARY, THEY OUGHT TO BE OLD ENOUGH TO RUN FOR COUNTY COMMISSIONER IF THEY WANT TO RUN. IF THEY'VE GOT A BETTER STORY TO TELL AND THEY CAN CONVINCE HOW MANY PEOPLE WE HAVE TO CONVINCE? 20,000?

>> 40. >> YOU ONLY HAVE TO GET THE MAJORITY. YOU JUST HAVE TO GET A MAJORITY. IF YOU CAN GO TELL THAT STORY AND GET THE VOTE YOU DESERVE TO BE ELECTED.

THAT'S WHAT OUR SYSTEM IS ABOUT.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A CERTIFICATE FROM CLAY COUNTY POLITICS AND THAT'S KINDA WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE.

I WILL BE AGAINST ADDING THE ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS.

THINK THERE ARE PHENOMENAL PEOPLE THAT ARE -- I'M GOING TO GO SO FAR AS TO SAY 16 OR 17 YEARS OLD I COULD DO A PHENOMENAL JOB AND GOING TO BE THE ONE THAT STANDS UP AND SAYS NOW. IF THEY CAN GO OUT AND BECAUSE OF THE VAST -- VOTES THEY DESERVE WHAT THEY GET.

>> TODAY, THE ONLY REQUIREMENT IS MAYBE A RESIDENT.

>> AND LEGAL AGE. >> I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY IN

[01:30:01]

BY NO MEANS WAS I ADVOCATING THAT YOU MUST BE A RESIDENT OF THE COUNTY. AS A BUSINESSPERSON, SOME OF THE DECIDING FACTORS OF THE SUCCESS OF THE COMPANY IS IF THEY GO OUT AND HIRE AN MBA VERSUS KEEPING IN THE FAMILY.

YOU CAN SUREFIRE KELLY COMPANY IF YOU DON'T BRING NEW, FRESH BLOOD TO THE TABLE. SO BY NO MEANS WAS I TRYING TO ADVOCATE FOR CITIZENSHIP WITHIN THE COUNTY FOR A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF YEARS. MY ONLY THOUGHT IS -- AND THIS IS JUST PURELY FORESHADOWING -- WE ARE SEEING CALIFORNIA AND NEW YORK WERE THE LARGEST MIGRATORY STATES TO THE STATE OF FLORIDA THIS YEAR. MY THOUGHT WAS THAT YOU BE A CITIZEN OF THE STATE OF FLORIDA FOR FIVE YEARS AND A MINIMUM AGE OF 25 YEARS OF AGE. AND THAT PARALLELS OUR STATE GOVERNMENT AS WELL WITH THE GOVERNOR HAVING A CERTAIN AGE.

I BELIEVE OUR STATE REPRESENTATIVES AND SENATORS HAVING A CERTAIN AGE AS WELL. BUT I'M NOT SOLD ON THIS.

I JUST THINK THERE'S GOING TO COME A TIME -- I KNOW FOLKS ARE MOVING FROM SOUTH FLORIDA TO THIS AREA AT HIGH NUMBERS, AND I SPOKE TO PROBABLY A DOZEN PEOPLE THIS WEEK FROM NEW YORK WITH DIFFERENT TYPES OF PEOPLE AND I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS FROM NEW YORK, BUT IF YOU ARE GOING TO COME HERE AND THINK LIKE A NEW YORKER TRADITIONALLY DOES AND WANT TO DO THINGS DIFFERENTLY THAT ARE CONTRARY TO WHAT OUR CITIZEN REALLY WANTS, OBVIOUSLY THE VOTERS ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO MAKE THE DECISION. BUT IT WOULDN'T BE A NORMAL THING FOR THEM TO HAVE RESIDENCY OR AT LEAST HISTORY OF THE STATE IF TO SAY, OKAY. THINGS ARE LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. THAT'S MY ONLY ALLOCATION IS THAT WE BRING NEW TALENT IN AND WE BRING THEM IN FROM DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE STATE, BUT THEY AT LEAST HAVE A MINIMUM REQUIREMENT TO LIVE IN THE STATE FOR FIVE YEARS PRIOR TO

BEING QUALIFIED TO RUN. >> ANY QUESTIONS ON THE SIDE?

>> I AND THE EXAMPLE OF YOU GUYS, WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT WITH THE MILITARY. THE HOUSE THAT I'M IN, I'VE BEEN THERE 10 YEARS AND I'M 63 YEARS OLD AND THAT'S THE LONGEST I'VE EVER LIVED IN ONE HOUSE.

I'VE GOT 40 YEARS OF MILITARY BEHIND ME AND LONGEST I'VE LIVED IN ANYONE ELSE'S THE ONE NOW.

10 YEARS. IT'S KIND OF CRAZY BUT IT'S

REALITY. >> I WILL WEIGH IN MY OPINION ON IT. I AGREE WITH DEBBIE AND OTHERS AND MITCH. I MYSELF BEING 27 YEARS IN THE MILITARY MOVED AROUND AS WELL AS MAKING CORPORATE MOVES.

PROBABLY WOULDN'T BE HERE TONIGHT IF THERE WERE RESTRICTIONS LIKE THAT. THAT MIGHT BE A GOOD THING.

I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE SAYING. THAT'S MY PERSONAL OPINION.

>> I UNDERSTAND WHERE THE THOUGHT PROCESS KIND OF CAME FROM BUT AGAIN, IT WOULDN'T JUST HAVE TO BE MILITARY.

MAYBE MOVING TO FLORIDA TO TAKE CARE OF A SICK FAMILY MEMBER OR BE CLOSER TO A FAMILY MEMBER AND THEY WANT TO RUN FOR OFFICE AND SERVE AND I DON'T THINK -- I KNOW SOME YOUNG PEOPLE ARE VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT OUR COUNTY AND VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT OUR AREA AND I DON'T FEEL LIKE -- THEY MAY HAVE MORE PASSION AND MORE IDEAS AND WORK IT UP AND GO AND A LOT OF ADULTS, AND IF THEY DIDN'T LIKE YOU SAID, IF THEY CAN GO OUT AND STIR UP THE VOTES, THEN THEY DESERVE THAT.

SO THAT'S JUST MY OPINION. >> I WOULD AGREE AND I WOULD ALSO SAY NOT ONLY MILITARY BUT CORPORATE MOVES.

ANOTHER EXAMPLE.ND ULTIMATELY MY OPINION -- THE VOTERS ARE GOING TO SPEAK AND THEY THINK THAT RESIDENCY ISSUE IS GOING TO COME AND PLAY THEY WILL VOTE FOR THE INDIVIDUAL.

THAT'S MY PERSONAL OPINION. >> THE ONLY RESTRICTION IS THEY MUST DRIVE DOWN BLANDING BOULEVARD FROM DEVOL COUNTY LINE TO KEYSTONE HEIGHTS AT LEAST FIVE TIME.

DURING RUSH HOUR. THAT'S A REQUIREMENT I THINK

[01:35:01]

THEY SHOULD HAVE. >> ALL RIGHT.

DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO PUT A RESIDENCY REQUIREMENT OR CHANGE THE MINIMUM QUALIFICATIONS AS THEY EXIST TODAY NOW? THEN THAT'S THE CASE WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ONE.

SALARIES FOR THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS.

SO BEFORE WE START I WOULD LIKE TO ASK CHAIRMAN BOLLA AND

COMMISSIONER SELLA. >> BEFORE THEY TALK AND I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY, CAN I ASK CHRIS A QUESTION? CAN YOUCOME TO THE MICROPHONE, CHRIS? AND I'M SAYING THIS BECAUSE CHANGING THE SALARY STRUCTURE HAS BEEN ON THE BALLOT NOT TOO LONG AGO AND IT WAS DEFEATED. SO MY QUESTION IS HOW TO REEDUCATE THE PEOPLE IN THE COUNTY WE ARE NOT JUST THROWING THIS AT THEM BUT HERE'S THE RATIONALE BEHIND WHY IS BEING DONE. AND I THINK WHAT I'VE HEARD FROM THEM BOTH IS -- I HAD A PART-TIME JOB AND GET PAID NEARLY AS MUCH AS THEY DID. AS A MATTER FACT I PAID THE CITY TO WORK FOR THEM. BUT IT IS A BIG JOB AND IT OUGHT TO BE TREATED THAT WAY. AND YOU GET KIND OF WHAT YOU PAY FOR. IF WE WERE TO COME FORWARD WITH A RECOMMENDATION ON SALARIES DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW, HOW DO WE POSITION THAT SO THAT THE ELECTOR WOULD UNDERSTAND WHAT THE INTENTION IS BEHIND THE CHANGE?

>> YOU RECOGNIZE ON THE SUPERVISOR OF ELECTIONS, RIGHT?

>> YES, SIR, I DO. >> WELL, I DID NOT STAY IN A HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS LAST NIGHT. SO THAT TAKES THAT OUT.

SO HERE IS -- YOU KNOW, YOU ALL HAVE A VERY DIFFICULT JOB.

YOU HAVE TO TAKE AN ORGANIZATION DOCUMENT SIMILAR TO THE CONSTITUTION, WHICH HAVE ALREADY TOLD MANY OF YOU ABOUT, AND YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO ADEQUATELY EXPLAIN TO THE CITIZENS OF CLAY COUNTY, NOT ONLY WHAT IT SAYS BUT WITH THE INTENT BEHIND IT WAS. SO IF I CAN TAKE A STEP BACK, I THINK THAT THE WHOLE REASON WHY THE SALARIES AND WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE SALARIES JUST WERE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS.

WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE SALARIES FOR CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS OR BOARD MEMBERS AND SO ON AND SO FORTH.

ELECTED OFFICIALS. IN THE STATUTES IT SAYS THAT YOU WILL REFER TO THE SALARY STUDY THAT IS BASED ON REVENUE IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA. THE EDR PUTS THAT OUT.

IT USUALLY COMES OUT ABOUT THE END OF THE FISCAL YEAR.

AND IT SAYS THAT THE SALARIES ARE SET AT A BASE RATE.

AND THEN ON TOP OF THAT BASE RATE FOR EVERY X AMOUNT OF CITIZENS WITHIN YOUR JURISDICTION, THAT ADDS TO THAT BASE RATE TO COME UP WITH THE DOLLAR AMOUNT.

FOR EXAMPLE, PREVIOUSLY, IN THE EDR FOR NOW, FOR COUNTY COMMISSIONER. IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN -- I HAVEN'T LOOKED AT IT OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD BUT I FIGURE OF $78,000 COULD BE DYSLEXIC. COULD BE $87,000.

FOR THE CLAY COUNTY COUNTY COMMISSIONERS.

THE THING THAT TO ME IS VERY DETRIMENTAL IS THAT THE SALARY BASED ON THE RESIDENCY FROM BRADFORD COUNTY IS MORE THAN THE SALARY FOR THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IN CLAY COUNTY.

WHAT'S DAMNING IS THE FACT THAT IN THE CHARTER IT STATES THAT SOUR CANNOT BE INCREASED WITHOUT GOING BEFORE THE CITIZENRY AND THE INITIATIVE. I THINK IT'S A VERY VALID POINT

[01:40:07]

AND AS YOU VOTE YOUR BALLOT, YOU BECOME TIRESOME IN THAT PROCESS. AND ONCE YOU GET DOWN TO THE FOURTH PAGE, THOSE OF THE THINGS THAT ARE VERY IMPORTANT TO US THAT AFFECT US DAY IN AND DAY OUT.

AND THAT'S WHEN YOU GET TO THE ITEMS THAT TALK ABOUT SALARIES.

AND WHEN YOU PUT IN THERE IN THE LANGUAGE IF YOU CAN'T MAKE A CHANGE TO THE COUNTY COMMISSIONER'S SALARY UNLESS HIS OWN INITIATIVE, THAT'S VERY PUNITIVE.

I MEAN, IN ANY LINE OF WORK YOU'RE GOING TO GET A COST-OF-LIVING INCREASE, HOWBEIT TYPICALLY IT WILL BE 1 TO 3 PERCENT IN COUNTY GOVERNMENT.

BUT THEY COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, THEY HAVE ZERO OPPORTUNITY.

AND SO HOW DO YOU PACKAGE THAT IN A WAY -- BECAUSE IF YOU MIGHT RECALL IN THE 2018 CRC AND THEY CRC FOR THE BALLOT IT WAS WHERE WE ARE GOING TO TIE IT TO A CPI.

THAT'S VERY REASONABLE. BUT LIKE TERM LIMITS, WHICH I'M OPPOSED TO. I HAVE BEEN OPPOSED ALL MY LIFE. I'M NOT CHANGING MY STRIPES.

JUST LIKE TERM LIMITS, JUST LIKE SALARY, THERE IS A FEELING THAT'S PERVASIVE ACROSS SOCIETY THAT IT'S AS VERSUS THE GOVERNMENT, AND WE, THE PEOPLE, LIKE WHAT OUR REPRESENTATION IS DOING OR NOT DOING. THEREFORE, ANYTHING THAT HAS TO DO WITH CHANGE, WHETHER IT'S CHANGE OF TIME, TERM, WHETHER IT'S A CHANGE OF SALARY, I DON'T THINK THAT IF YOU WENT TO ANYBODY IN THE COUNTY AND SAID DO YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH THE FACT THAT YOU MAY GET A THREE PERCENT COST-OF-LIVING INCREASE THIS YEAR? THAT IN SOCIETY, EVERYBODY WOULD BE FOR THAT. BUT WHEN IT GOES ON TO A BALLOT AND WE ARE TALKING ABOUT GOVERNMENT, WE ARE OPPOSED TO IT. SO I JUST WANT TO SAY I REALIZE HOW DIFFICULT THIS IS. HOW YOU CAN PACKAGE SOMETHING THAT TAKES -- THAT REALLY JUST TAKES THE FEELING, THE PASSION THAT ONE MIGHT HAVE ABOUT THEIR LACK OF REPRESENTATION OR THEIR REPRESENTATION OR THEIR GOVERNMENT AND PACKAGE THAT INTO SOMETHING THAT IS FAIR, EQUITABLE, REASONABLE.

I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU DO THAT. GOD BLESS YOU ALL.

I CAN'T ANSWER YOUR QUESTION. >> HE MUST BE A POLITICIAN.

>> FOR CLARIFICATION, I DIDN'T EXPECT FOR US TO GIVE US A SILVER BULLET.HAT I AM ASKING IS ASIDE FROM GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS, HOW WE MARKET THAT? YOU MAKE A SUGGESTION THAT WE PUT THAT ASIDE FOR --

>> I WILL DEFER. ALYSSA SAYS WE WILL INCREASE THEIR PAY TO ASK, THAT'S HARDER TO DEAL WITH THAN BEING ABLE TO MARKET THAT SAY HERE IS WHY WE ARE DOING THAT.

>> I MEAN THAT'S OUT OF THE PURVIEW AND WE SAY WE ARE GOING

[01:45:05]

BALLOT. >> IF THAT'S THE LIMIT OF WHAT WE CAN DO. THERE IS NO EXPLANATION WHY WE CAN PUT THAT -- PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO VOTE FOR POLITICIANS

TO PAY THEM MORE. >> I WILL BE OUT OF OFFICE OF THOTONOASSASA'S. YOU ARE NOT PAYING -- I DO MY TAXES MYSELF AND ABOUT TWO YEARS AGO I REALIZE MY WIFE IS MAKING MORE MONEY AS A SCHOOL BOARD MEMBER THAN I AM AS A COUNTY COMMISSIONER. AND THERE'S NO WAY THAT I'M EVER GOING TO GET ANY MORE MONEY, PERIOD.

THAT'S LOCKED IN RIGHT NOW. WHEN THAT WAS PASSED THAT WAS A PUNITIVE THING. AND EVERYBODY KNOWS THAT.

THERE WERE ISSUES ON THE COUNTY COMMISSIONS AND EVERYBODY GOT BEHIND IT AND SAID LET'S FIX IT, AND THEY DID.

ARE YOU GOING TO CHANGE IT BACK NOW? I DON'T KNOW. I THINK YOU COULD SAY WE ARE GOING TO LET THE STATE RECOMMEND WHAT THE NUMBER IS AND WE WILL PAY THEM ANY MORE THAN THAT.

AND THAT'S THE BEST I CAN COME UP WITH.> THANK YOU.

>> I THINK I GOT A CALL AND I HAVE TO GO HOME AND CAN'T

COMMENT ON THIS. >> THE CAMERA NEVER BLINKS, A TRICKY QUESTION FOR ANY KIND OF CITY COMMISSIONER.

SORT OF THE THIRD RAIL OF CLAY COUNTY POLITICS.

WHAT SHOULD YOU GET PAID. YOU KNOW, I -- I KNEW WHAT THE PAY WAS BEFORE I RAN. YOU SORT OF KNOW WHAT THE DEAL IS BEFORE YOU MAKE THE DECISION TO THROW YOUR HAT IN THE RING.

YOU HAVE TO BE SURPRISED REALLY QUICKLY.

AND SO I KNEW WHAT I WAS IN STORE FOR.

MY PREDECESSOR TOLD ME THAT THE POSITION COST MORE MONEY THAN THEY MADE AND I DIDN'T BELIEVE THEM BUT I CAN SEE MORE THAT COULD HAPPEN. SO I DO BELIEVE THAT THE COUNTY IS GOING TO HAVE TO FACE THAT ISSUE AT SOME POINT AND SOME POINT SON IN REGARDS TO AN INCREASE IN THE PAY THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IS NOW THE LOWEST ELECTED OFFICIAL PAY IN THE COUNTY. THE SCHOOL BOARD HAS GONE BY AND THEY GET AN INCREASE EVERY YEAR.

SO THAT INCREASE, THAT'S OVER THE 37 FIVE OR WHATEVER IT IS.

AND I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS 78,000.

SO I'M COUNTING UPON THE MONEY BUT I KNEW IT WAS IN THE 70S BECAUSE EVERY YEAR WHEN THE NEW ONE COMES OUT I HAVE A PRETTY GOOD FRIEND WHO IS A COMMISSIONER AND SENDS ME THAT LIST AND CIRCLES CLAY COUNTY AND SO HE GIVES IT TO ME PRETTY GOOD. BUT I DO BELIEVE TO CONTINUALLY ATTRACT THE BEST AND BRIGHTEST YOU HAVE TO MAKE IT MORE ATTRACTIVE.ND ANECDOTALLY AND CHRIS MAY HAVE A BETTER HANDLE ON IT I RESEARCH THE PREVIOUS RAISES FOR DISTRICT 1 AND SOME OF THE OTHER DISTRICTS AS WELL.

MULTIPLE CANDIDATES RAN.HREE OR FOUR IN DISTRICT 1 SEVERAL TIMES. IN FACT EVEN WHEN WENDELL DAVIS WON HIS FIRST COUNTY COMMISSION RACE I BELIEVE IT WAS IN 2008

[01:50:01]

WE HAVE TO DO IS LOOK AT THE LAST THREE OR FOUR ELECTIONS.

COMMISSIONER HUTCHINS RAN UNOPPOSED AND I RAN UNOPPOSED AND THAT NEVER HAPPENED IN GREGG COUNTY BEFORE.

THERE WAS SOMEBODY WILLING TO STEP UP AND RUN.

WHY? YOU HAVE TO ASK PEOPLE WHY THEY DIDN'T RUN. IT WAS MARCH AND THEY JUMPED IN CLAIMING THAT JUST WANT ME TO RUN UNOPPOSED.

SO PAY WOULD BE A CERTAIN PART OF IT.HE OTHER WAY TO LOOK AT THIS THING IS ME TALK ABOUT ANECDOTALLY THIS IS A PART-TIME JOB. IF YOU ARE GOING TO PAY SOMEBODY WHATEVER THE STATE FORMULA IS, YOU CAN HOLD THIS COMMISSIONER'S PETE TO THE FIRE THEY ARE COMFORTABLE.

THEY HAD BETTER GET SOMETHING DONE FOR YOU IF YOU ARE A COUNTY CITIZEN THAT CALLS UP AND SAYS I HAVE PROBLEMS MY THREE TOP 10 HITS IS OUR BRIDGE ROADS AND DRAINAGE.

WE HAVE AN EXCITING LIFE AS COMMISSIONERS AND THAT'S WHAT WE DEAL WITH ON A DAILY BASIS. YOU COULD DEMAND MORE OUT OF THEM. AS A COMMISSIONER THAT'S NOT DOING A JOB, IT'S A PART-TIME JOB.

WE MIGHT GET YOU NEXT WEEK. WHETHER IT'S THE STATE SCALE OR ANOTHER SCALE OF PAY, I THINK WE WILL CONTINUE TO ATTRACT SOLID LINES AND NOTHING THAT WILL HAVE TO BE ADJUSTED AT

SOME POINT. >> RIVER RIDGE WAS ON THE BALLOT WHEN THIS THING WAS LOCKED IN AT 37,000 OR WHATEVER IT IS, IS THAT VERBIAGE AVAILABLE?

>> SURE. >> COULD YOU SHARE THAT WITH US ON EMAIL SHE NEEDS A VACATION. THREE WEEKS.

FAX THE FLOOR IS OPEN FOR DISCUSSION.

>> I KIND OF LIVED THROUGH THAT.

CHRIS SAID SOMETHING INTERESTING.

WITH GOVERNMENT AGAINST US AND IT'S US AGAINST HIM AND THAT'S GOTTEN WORSE AND WORSE OVER THE YEARS.

THE DESIGN OF THE COUNTY COMMISSION STRUCTURE SALARY AND THE FACT THAT BY CHANGE MY INITIATIVE ABSOLUTELY WAS PUNITIVE. IT WAS NOT REALITY BASED OR RATIONALLY BASED. IT WAS I'M MAD AND I'M GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. HOWEVER THEY WENT OUT GOT SIGNATURES AND GOT IT DONE AND THE VOTERS VOTED FOR.

HOW IS THE PREVAILING INTEREST AT THE TIME.

WE WOULD HAVE TO UNDO IT IN A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT DIRECTIONS IN AMOUNT AND BY INITIATIVE, AND I'M NOT SURE, BECAUSE WE ARE JUST HERE TO DO THIS. WE WON'T BE OUTSELLING IT, EXPLAINING IT, RATIONALIZING IT.

I'M NOT SURE CHANGING IT WILL GO ANYWHERE.

YOU HAVE TO BE BUT THE COMMISSIONER SAID.

WE WILL GET TO THE POINT WHERE WE CAN'T GET ANYBODY TO DO THIS JOB. LOOK WHAT A HOUSE COST ON FLEMING ISLAND WHEN YOU STARTED OUT.

WHAT WOULD IT COSTS NOW. AT A POUND OF HAMBURGER.

IF YOU EXPECT TO GET QUALITY PEOPLE, PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO DO IT. IT'S BAD ENOUGH YOU GET CALLED ABOUT GARBAGE AND ROADS AND DRAINAGE FOR $31,000 YEAR EVENTUALLY WE ARE GOING TO BE IN A POSITION WHERE IT'S A VOLUNTEER JOB. I WOULD HOPE WE GET A QUALITY OF VOLUNTEER BUT AT SOME POINT IN TIME IT'S NOT.

I DON'T THINK THE VOTERS HAVE ANY INTENTION OF DOING THIS AND WE WOULD BE BEATING A DEAD HORSE.

THE PUNITIVE NATURE OF THAT WILL HAVE TO RUN ITS COURSE.

YOU CAN'T CHANGE ITS COURSE. >> I DISAGREE.

YOU KNOW, I HOPE THE VOTERS A LITTLE SMARTER AND HOWEVER IT'S WORDED, IF WE WANT GOOD COMMISSIONERS IN THIS COUNTY, THIS IS WHAT WE NEED TO DO. THIS IS THE DAY THE FACT THEY

[01:55:01]

>> WE PASSED A ONE CENT TAX ON THE SCHOOL BOARD.

HALF A PENNY, SO THE ELECTORATE DECIDED TO COUGH UP HALF A PENNY AND THERE WAS SOMETHING GOING ON WE WOULD GET THESE NEW BUILDINGS AND SCHOOLS UPDATED AND ALL THAT GOOD STUFF SO MAYBE THERE WAS SOME PERCEIVED VALUE.

I AM A SMALL GOVERNMENT GUY. GET IT DONE WITH LESS EXPENDITURE. TRUST ELECTRIC TO SAY BY THE WAY, WE WENT TO GET THESE GUYS A RAISE MAY BE AN ILL BEEDE TO STEEP OF A CLIMB BUT AT THE SAME TIME THEY BOUGHT 1/2 PERCENT INCREASE FOR THE SCHOOL BOARD.

TO YOUR POINT, PEOPLE ARE REASONABLE WE CAN LOOK AT $37,000 AND SO WHAT DO THIS FOR $37,000.

BUT TO SERVE AGAIN WAS NOT ALWAYS SOMEONE IS LOOKING FOR $42,000. 37 TO BE THE NUMBER AND THAT'S FINE. I LIKE THE MODEL.

DOES THE STATE OF FLORIDA HAVE A CALCULATION, A MEAN INCOME WITH THE STATE? I THINK IN ORDER TO BE ARBITRARY AND SAY WE THINK THESE GUYS ARE WORTH 42,000 BUCKS WE WILL SHOOT OURSELVES IN THE FOOT.

I THINK IF YOU TAKE A LEGISLATIVE APPROACH THAT'S IN THE BOOK FROM THE STATE OF FLORIDA COMMENTED HAS ANYONE DONE THAT MATH? DOES IT WORK OUT BETTER THAN $37,000? 78.

OKAY. DEPENDING ON NOW THIS THING IS WRITTEN IF WE DISCLOSE -- WE WOULD HAVE TO DISCLOSE A POTENTIAL CALCULATION OR LET THE VOTER FIGURE IT OUT HIMSELF. YOU KNOW, I BELIEVE TO GET THE PEOPLE YOU HAVE TO PAY THEM IN TODAY'S WORLD BUT I'M ALSO A BELIEVER IN SMALL GOVERNMENT AND GET IT DONE FOR LESS.

MAYBE IT'S NOT THE PERSON WHO'S TRYING TO MAKE A STEPPINGSTONE BUT HERE SHE HAS SERVED ANY BUSINESS ROLE OR WHATEVER CAPACITY AND THEY JUST WANT TO GO BACK AND SERVE THEIR COMMUNITY. AND YOU PICK UP LUNCH FOR ME AT 37,000 YEAR IT TAKES ALL KINDS. TO ASK THE COMPANY TO VOTE I

THINK IS CRAZY. >> (INDISCERNIBLE).

>> I AM SO SORRY ABOUT MY VOICE.

WE JUST HAD TO GO THROUGH ALL THAT TO GET INCREASE PAY FOR THEM SO I DO WANT TO POINT THEM OUT.

I DEFINITELY THINK THAT THE COMMISSIONERS THAT DESERVE MORE MONEY HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO GET A RAISE.

I READ ALL THAT THIS WEEK AND I THOUGHT YOU GET NOTHING ELASTIC IS BACK BEFORE THE VOTERS? I KIND OF AT LEAST LIKE THE YEARLY INCREASE. SOMETHING THAT IS A LARGER AMOUNT THAT THE STATE HAS IS TOO MUCH

>> I THINK IT IS SOMETHING THAT COULD GET DONE ANGER VOTED ON AT LEAST ONE OR TWO OTHER CHARTERS FROM OTHERS IN FLORIDA I HAVE SEEN HAVE CAPPED AT A PERCENTAGE OF WHAT THE STATE RECOMMENDS A VOTE WAS PRESENTED ON THE BALLOT THAT WE WANT TO INCREASE OUR COMMISSIONERS PAY TO 70 PERCENT IT'S KIND OF A GOAT YOU DON'T WANT TO SELL IT

[02:00:19]

>> THIS IS 1/3 CHARTER EVERYONE I HAVE BEEN UNDER WHEN PEOPLE FIND OUT I AM SERVING ON IT THEY DON'T WANT TO INCREASE THOSE SALARIES THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS +1 OF THE FIRST THING THEY SAY IN THE TALK ABOUT TERM LIMITS BUT THEY MOSTLY DON'T WANT TO PAY THEM MORE MONEY AND SO LIKE I SAID THIS IS THE THIRD ONE I HAVE SERVED ON AND I HAVE NO COUNTY COMMISSIONER HAS EVER ASKED ME TO ADVOCATE FOR A RAISE FOR THEM FOR FUTURE COMMISSIONS OR ANYTHING THEY HAVE NEVER ASKED ME TO PURSUE THAT AND I HAVE HEARD FROM A LOT OF PEOPLE OUT THERE THEY SAY THAT'S RIDICULOUS YOU PUT IT OUT THERE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO INCREASE THEIR PAY THAT'S ABSOLUTELY FALSE SO IF IT'S GOING TO BE A HEAVY LIFT I AM TELLING YOU LIKE LAST TIME IN THE TIME BEFORE THAT BUT THEY ARE GOING TO VOTE IT DOWN AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO SO I AM HESITANT TO BRING IT UP AGAIN AND YOU ASKED THEM TO DO THIS I UNDERSTAND THE REASONS WHY BUT THE VOTERS DON'T WANT

TO DO THAT >> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A SIMPLE GENERIC STATEMENT AND I SHOULDN'T EVEN SAY THIS I AM NOT TRYING TO SKIRT THE ISSUE THE STATUE WHICH HAS THE EDR AM I CORRECT? IN THE EQUATION IS THERE WHICH IS BASED UPON A BASE SALARY PLUS POPULATION AND THE VERBIAGE THIS COULD BE WORSE FOR WEEKS AND DAYS AND MONTHS BEFORE WE GET IT TO WHERE IT NEEDS TO BE BUT TO WRDSMITH THIS IN NO WAY THAT'S FIRM IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE NUMBERS I THINK THIS COMMISSION OF US SITTING HERE CAN AGREE THAT THE COUNTY COMMISSIONER SHOULD BE PAID IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE STATE OF FLORIDA STANDARDS THAT THEIR SALARY, AND I AM NOT GOING TO MENTION A NUMBER OR A PERCENTAGE I THINK THE MAJORITY OF THIS YEAR WOULD AGREE THAT THE CLAY COUNTY COMMISSIONERS SHOULD BE PAID WITH THE STATE STANDARD.

IN THAT STATEMENT SHOULD WE AGREE IT SHOULD BE PAID MORE THIS COULD PROBABLY AGREE ON PAYING THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE STANDARD FOR PUBLIC COUNTY COMMISSIONERS ACCORDING TO THE EDR. IS THAT AN INCREASE? IT IS BUT IN FOUR MORE YEARS IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE STANDARDS SO A LONG-TERM AND IT WILL BE ON THE BOOKS FOR THE NEXT FOUR

[02:05:17]

IN THIS CASE IT WILL BE A GOOD PAY RAISE FOR YEARS FROM NOW

WON'T BE >> YOU SAY WE SHOULD PUT IT ON AND YOU PUT IT ON THE BALLOT THAT WE DON'T HAVE A FINAL WORD. AND WE MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE VOTERS THIS IS WHERE THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT AND FOLKS LIKE THAT.

>> I HAVE DONE SOME LIMITED RESEARCH AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS YOU CAN'T JUST SAY IT IS A GENERAL TERM.

YOU HAVE TO APPLY SOME KIND OF A NUMBER THAT HAS TO BE INCLUDED.

>> THAT'S A GOOD THING. AND YOU ARE RIGHT BECAUSE THE FLORIDA STATUTES I SKIMMED THROUGH IT BRIEFLY AND I BECAME GLASSY EYES AND THEY SAID THE 6 O'CLOCK NEWS IS COMING ON BUT ANYWAY IF WE LOOK AT THAT VERBIAGE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE BASE SALARY AND POPULATION I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE ANSWER IS.

>> IT WOULD REQUIRE YOU TO TAKE A STEP FURTHER AND I WOULD DO SOME MORE RESEARCH ON THAT 37,078 YOU CAN ARCHITECT THAT IN THE WAY THAT WILL BE SOME INCREASES THAT WAY PEOPLE DON'T GET HIT WITH A BIG NUMBER UPFRONT BUT THE FIRST QUESTION HAS TO BE DO WE THINK THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS WORTH MORE THAN WHAT THEY ARE BEING PAID AND WE WANT TO HAVE A FORMAT THAT WILL GET US TO THAT NUMBER AND HOW WE LET THE ATTORNEY WORDED AND HOW WE CAN PUT IT AND SO IS NOT THERE HAS TO BE A NUMBER OUT THERE. I KEEP HEARING THIS WAS PUNITIVE WHEN THEY ADDRESSED IT BEFORE AND IF THAT WAS THE CASE CERTAINLY THIS PARTICULAR ISSUE IS WORTH TRYING TO CLEAN UP BECAUSE WE KEEP WANTING CLAY COUNTY TO BE AT THIS CERTAIN LEVEL AND STILL WE ARE TRYING TO GET MORE OUT OF REPRESENTATIVES FOR LOSS AND WE UNDERSTAND PEOPLE GETTING TO THE POLITICAL ASPECT OR THE END OF THE DAY FOR 380,000,400 OPERATION BY COMMISSIONERS 30 SOME THOUSAND DOLLARS THAT SEEMS VERY UNREASONABLE. TO EXPECT THAT OUT OF THE LEADERSHIP.

>> I TEND TO AGREE WITH MR. MCNAIR ESSENTIALLY WE HAD TWO PIECES TO THIS SO IS THERE A CONSENSUS THAT WE CAN TAKE A

[02:10:01]

BACK FOR THE SECOND >> AND I WILL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE PROCEED WITH INCREASING THE COMMISSIONERS PAY THAT AMOUNT TO BE DETERMINED AT A FUTURE MEETING.

>> IT'S OPEN FOR DISCUSSION ANY COMMENTS ON THAT?

>> I HAVE OPTIMISTS ON EITHER SIDE OF ME AND BOTH OF YOUR POINTS ARE WELL TAKEN WE NEED TO GET THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE A GOOD DECISION AND IF WE ARE GOING TO RUN IT APPROPRIATELY MAYBE WE NEED TO GIVE THEM THE MONEY TO MAKE THE APPROPRIATE EXECUTIVES IN PLACE SO I AM CHANGING MY NEGATIVE OPINION.

>> DULY NOTED.

>> WE NEED TO PUT IT TO THE VOTERS LET THEM DETERMINE

>> WE HAVE A MOTION AND IT HAS BEEN SECONDED THAT WE WANT TO INCREASE THE PAY OF THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS WITH A FINAL DECISION AS TO HOW THEY ARE DEFERRED UNTIL A FUTURE MEETING AND FOR HIM TO COME BACK TO US WITH HIS INFORMATION IS THAT CORRECT? IS THERE ANY MORE DISCUSSION ON

THIS? >> I JUST HAVE A QUESTION I LOOKED OVER AND I LOOKED OVER THE CALCULATIONS TODAY THE FORMULA AND THE ONE THEY USE ON THEIR IS A CHARTER COUNTY AND IF I AM NOT MISTAKEN THAT AMOUNT WAS ONE 75,000

>> THE POPULATION IS >> THEY ARE UNDER 300,000 BUT I THOUGHT MAYBE I WAS LOOKING AT THE WRONG PAGE IT WAS SIGNIFICANT SO I APOLOGIZE I WILL GO BACK AND STUDY THAT

>> THAT'S THE SECOND PART OF THE DECISION.

>> IF WE DO COME BACK WE WANT TO GET WITH THE ACTUAL NUMBER IS. AND THEN IN THE PAST THERE WAS HISTORICAL INFORMATION SO I AM CURIOUS HISTORICALLY WITH THE SALARY WAS AT THAT TIME VERSUS WHAT THE STATE RECOMMENDED IN THE EARLY 90S AND ON PAGE 19 IN THE EARLY 2000'S 2016 THERE ARE TWO DATES HERE SO I AM GOING TO TRY TO DIG UP SOME OF THAT FOR

INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES >> ANY RESEARCH THAT FOR US? SO THAT'S HOW WE WILL DO THAT. TERESA WILL DO IT AND THEN WORK IN CONJUNCTION SO WE STILL HAVE THE FIRST PART WHICH IS TO TAKE A VOTE WHETHER OR NOT TO INCREASE THE COMMISSIONERS SALARY AND THAT THE AMOUNT AND THE PERIOD OF TIME IN WHICH WE ARE GOING TO RECOMMEND TO THE VOTERS THAT WILL BE DEFERRED UNTIL A FUTURE MEETING ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

OPPOSED? AND THE MOTION CARRIES.

OKAY. THE NEXT ITEM ON THERE WAS REVISED CHARTER TOPIC SUGGESTIONS BUT I THINK WE WENT THROUGH THAT THE LAST TIME DID WE NOT?

>> CAN I ASK FOR A CLEAN LIST OF OUR REVISED CHARTER COPY IS THAT POSSIBLE MS. TERESA?

>> AND WHEN YOU DO IT JUST SEND THAT OUT THANK YOU.

I HAVE ONE ITEM UNDER NEW BUSINESS AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT I'M GOING TO JUST PUT OUT TO EVERYBODY IF I WENT BACK TO THE FIRST TWO MEETINGS WE ALL HAD A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF FRUSTRATION OVER THE FACT THAT WE DID NOT FULLY UNDERSTAND WHAT WE WERE GOING TO BE EXPECTED TO DO EXCEPT THOSE WHO

[02:15:01]

>> I APPROACHED COURTNEY ON THIS OVER THE HOLIDAYS BECAUSE I HAD THE SAME THOUGHTS THAT YOU DID AND HER RECOMMENDATION IS THAT WE WOULD PUT IT IN THE FORM OF A MOTION THAT THAT BE DONE AND THAT BE DIRECTED TO STAFF AND DID I SAY THAT CORRECTLY?

>> YOU WANT TO PUT A MOTION FORWARD AND THEN WE HAVE A SECOND? WE WILL PROVIDE AN OUTLINE TO THE TURNOVER PACKAGE THAT WILL BECOME A PERMANENT PART AND NEW COMMISSIONS AND THE WILL OUTLINE THE ITEMS TO BE IN THAT PACKAGE.

>> WE HAVE A MOTION THIS COMMISSION WILL PROVIDE A PACKAGE AND AN OUTLINE AND A RECOMMENDATION TO THE STAFF FOR FUTURE BOARDS AND THAT THE MEMBERS WILL CONTRIBUTE ITEMS

FOR THAT TURNOVER FILE >> I WILL AMEND THE MOTION TO

MAKE THAT STATEMENT >> IT'S A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS TO PROVIDE A PASSED DOWN TURNOVER FILE FOR FUTURE CRC AND WE HAVE A SECOND ON THAT.

ALL IN FAVOR? AYE OPPOSED? VERY GOOD THANK YOU. WE HAVE ONE LAST SECTION FOR

[CRC MEMBER COMMENTS]

>> WE JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE DATES STRAIGHT AND NO CONFLICTS ALL RIGHT. 3 FEBRUARY 7 PM IN THE LAST MINUTE COMMENTS?

>> I HAVE A QUICK ONE. I SERVE ON SOME MOTHERBOARDS OF LESSER IMPORTANCE AND IS NICE.DIFFERING OPINIONS AND DIFFERENT VIEWPOINTS AND NO ONE IS GETTING CRAZY SO THANK YOU IT WAS A PLEASURE AND THE PUBLIC CLIMATES AND POLITICAL CLIMATE IS NICE TO SEE A GROUP HAVE DIFFERING OPINIONS AND ACTUALLY BE NICE.

>> THANK YOU.

>> ARE WE ON TRACK TIMEWISE?

>> THE NEXT MEETING I WOULD LIKE TO COME BACK TO THE IDEA OF COMPENSATION THAT WE TALKED ABOUT AND ALSO DISCUSS SECTION 3 AND FOLLOWING THAT IF WE STAY ON TRACK SECTION 4 THAT WOULD FINISH EVERYTHING IN THE CHARTER WE CAN WORK ON THE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR THE BALLOT. I THANK YOU FOR

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.